3G+iPhone=iPhone v2

[iMav]

ok u bought the iPhone great going u fool

Talking about the 3G iPhone at a meeting in California, AT&T CEO Randall Stephenson declared: "You'll have it next year." He didn't add any specifics but we hope this is not just some general statement (3G being the obvious next step in the iPhone) and that they are already well into the development phase, perhaps taking advantage of the latest low-consumption 3G chipsets to solve Steve Jobs concerns about a 3G iPhone's battery life. The comment is in line with previous comments from Telefonica insiders, who pointed out to Gizmodo that the spanish company would have delayed the introduction of the iPhone to next year thinking that a non-3G version wouldn't work in the Spanish market.

Source

now only if he would make the other dumb glitches go away

[infra_red_dude]

This was expected and so here we haf it iPhone v2, iPhone SDK etc.

Originally Posted by iMav

ok u bought the iPhone great going u fool

Don't worry. Doesn't apply to most of us. All those "fools" who bought the First Gen iPhone are from cash rich countries (like US and now UK) who never give a damn for "value for money". They wudn't mind throwing their older iPhones for the version 2!!!

[narangz]

^^I know many persons with iPhone here

[infra_red_dude]

^^^ It doesn't matter to them, either! No 3G for sometime here!

[Gigacore]

huh.... they could've done in the First Gen iPhone itself... this is all a business GIMMICK

[naveen_reloaded]

I wont buy it..more over india is still behind many country for not having 3g...
When will 3g hit india?any guess

[New]

After the announcement of 6G 3G hits India

[aryayush]

Originally Posted by iMav

ok u bought the iPhone great going u fool

"If you always wait for the next price cut or to buy the new improved model, you'll never buy any technology product because there is always something better and less expensive on the horizon."

[desiibond]

Originally Posted by aryayush

"If you always wait for the next price cut or to buy the new improved model, you'll never buy any technology product because there is always something better and less expensive on the horizon."

There are some products that provide perfect balance of price and performance at launch.

1) AMD K8 architecture
2) 8800GT
3) Nintendo Wii
4) Nokia E61i
5) AT&T Tilt (One of the most powerful smartphones with unique tilt design)
6) SE W580i
7) Nokia 5700
8) Intel Conroe architecture

And there are many more. These products belong to a family that do justice to purse. Unlike few products (PS3, HTC Athena) that just burn a hole in your pocket.

[eggman]

Originally Posted by aryayush

"If you always wait for the next price cut or to buy the new improved model, you'll never buy any technology product because there is always something better and less expensive on the horizon."

I don't know what improvement means to you , but for me it is addition of feature or something to the existing model,which was not available or feasible at the time of its release.

Now , 3G was always there and was no big deal in providing it.

My w810 now cost around 10k but it was 16 k last year.But it had everything that one could've expected in 16k last year.So although it got cheaper but it was no way expensive last year.

And desiibond pointed out the list very well.

[aryayush]

Originally Posted by eggman

I don't know what improvement means to you , but for me it is addition of feature or something to the existing model,which was not available or feasible at the time of its release.

Now , 3G was always there and was no big deal in providing it.

3G affects battery life. The first generation iPhone is, in a way, primarily for the American market and 3G is not as prevalent there as in the European countries.

Apple had to choose between better battery life and 3G connectivity and they chose the former option which, from my own point of view, was the right one. It already has Wi-Fi and that's all I would need.

Obviously, they will figure out how to include 3G in a future model but that does not mean that everyone who bought the previous model a year and a half ago was taken for a ride. Products are always going to keep getting better and better. You can't keep stalling your purchase forever...

[infra_red_dude]

Originally Posted by aryayush

3G affects battery life.

The worst excuse I've ever seen! I mean... haha... Ok No comments!

Originally Posted by aryayush

The first generation iPhone is, in a way, primarily for the American market and 3G is not as prevalent there as in the European countries.

While the comparison is perfectly alright, 3G in US is not as you put in. 3G was first intro'd in US in 2003 (or 2002?). This year if the sales of the handsets are anything to go by then that will give an idea about 3G in US.

Originally Posted by aryayush

Apple had to choose between better battery life and 3G connectivity and they chose the former option which, from my own point of view, was the right one.

Actually to conserve battery life they couldn've excluded the camera, wifi etc. All these hog battery more than "3G"!

Originally Posted by aryayush

It already has Wi-Fi and that's all I would need.

While I agree its a nice move by Apple to include 4G (WiFi), YOU are not the ONLY customer! Or mebbe Apple asks you everytime they release something Again, its just sales' tactics. The Britons are "foolish" enough to buy non-3G iPhones. 3G in Europe (as said by Aayush) is like lungs to the telecom industry!

Originally Posted by aryayush

Obviously, they will figure out how to include 3G in a future model...

They don't need to "figure" out. They just need to release the models that were/are 3G ready (just like "Intel Macs" were ready since the dayz of Mac OS X 10.1).

Originally Posted by aryayush

... but that does not mean that everyone who bought the previous model a year and a half ago was taken for a ride.

Of corz not, the people chose to sit in the Roller Coaster themselves!

Originally Posted by aryayush

Products are always going to keep getting better and better. You can't keep stalling your purchase forever...

I fully agree with you regarding this. Every bit!

My cuz recently bought an iPod Touch and I must say that the exprience of using it in itself is an amazing one. As the Mac Guys say, the iPhone has nothing "new" but the way we "do" things on it is different. And I agree to each word of theirs

[iMav]

arre infra ... 3g eats battery he didnt say - el jobso said

and as far as tech being better and better is 1 thing and accepted i always recomend buying the best ur budget can get u but i certainly dont say buy blindly when u pretty well know that its gonna be very soon that the update is gonna be made its not like vista that if u buy genuine u will get sp1 for free .... u arent gonna get the 3g chip embedded in ur v1 once v2 comes out and v1 v2 whats the time difference hardly a year ....

having said taht i can pretty well say that wen iphone v1 comes out in china or india within 2 months us will get v2 ....

[desiibond]

Originally Posted by iMav

arre infra ... 3g eats battery he didnt say - el jobso said

and as far as tech being better and better is 1 thing and accepted i always recomend buying the best ur budget can get u but i certainly dont say buy blindly when u pretty well know that its gonna be very soon that the update is gonna be made its not like vista that if u buy genuine u will get sp1 for free .... u arent gonna get the 3g chip embedded in ur v1 once v2 comes out and v1 v2 whats the time difference hardly a year ....

having said taht i can pretty well say that wen iphone v1 comes out in china or india within 2 months us will get v2 ....

Yes. and India doesn't even need V2 with 3G.

let them provide reliabel EDGE connection, then they can think of 3G.

3G iphone is just a marketing tactic. Put 3G and increase the price further. Increase the profits.

First release phone without 3G. Then put 3G on it and increase the price.

It's not impossible to put battery with more power in the first edition itself if Jobs thinks that 3G will drain battery.

[goobimama]

Soon? I don't think the iPhonev2 is going to be out before June 08 so one year in the works is quite a long time for a new product to come. Also, I don't think they will increase the price. They might introduce a 16GB for a higher price, but there's no way the price is going to increase from the $400 that it is right now.

The iPhone gives 7-8 hours talktime. That's battery life.

[gxsaurav]

Originally Posted by aryayush

3G affects battery life.

Right, what about all other phones which support 3G fine?

The first generation iPhone is, in a way, primarily for the American market and 3G is not as prevalent there as in the European countries.

U R wrong, in USA 3G Is there more then Europe.

Apple had to choose between better battery life and 3G connectivity and they chose the former option which, from my own point of view, was the right one. It already has Wi-Fi and that's all I would need.

Starbucks isn't available in India yet

[iamtheone]

Originally Posted by aryayush

they chose the former option which, from my own point of view, was the right one.

oh how surprising......

[eggman]

Originally Posted by iamtheone

oh how surprising......

he he

[aryayush]

@infra_red_dude, I know that you know a lot more about mobile phones than I do. I acknowledge and respect that. But I'm not a total goner either.

So take my reply in the right spirit, like you always do.

Originally Posted by infra_red_dude

The worst excuse I've ever seen! I mean... haha... Ok No comments!

First, the trailer:

Look at this thread. Read the second post. Turning 3G off on the N95 saves a lot of battery.

Then, read this article on AnandTech: No 3G on the iPhone, but why? A Battery Life Analysis

These are Anand Lal Shimpi's final words:

Without a doubt, current 3G implementations do require more space and consume more power than simply outfitting a phone with support for EDGE. Using the Samsung Blackjack as an example, turning on 3G reduces battery life by around 25% under web/email use. The biggest impact of all is, surprisingly enough, talk time; with 3G enabled, the Blackjack's talk time is cut in half, with absolutely no benefit realized from the higher bandwidth standard.

At the same time, Apple's choice to include 802.11b/g support in the iPhone makes a lot of sense. Battery life actually increases with Wi-Fi over EDGE whenever the data connection is being used, not to mention that performance goes up tremendously as well.

Apple had to make a number of tradeoffs with the iPhone, and without a doubt its power hungry screen was not worth sacrificing, even for better network performance. The iPhone's biggest selling point is its UI, and Apple seems to have made the right tradeoff by embracing Wi-Fi for the first generation - as frustrating as it may be for users.

The long term solution however isn't simply to rely on Wi-Fi hotspots for faster net access, as 3G deployments become even more widespread and technology improves you can expect to see lower power and more tightly integrated 3G chipsets available. We'd venture a guess that a 3G iPhone is at least 12 months out, but until then keep an eye out for 802.11 hotspots - you'll get a better usage experience and better battery life on your iPhone.

[Emphasis added.]

Originally Posted by infra_red_dude

While the comparison is perfectly alright, 3G in US is not as you put in. 3G was first intro'd in US in 2003 (or 2002?). This year if the sales of the handsets are anything to go by then that will give an idea about 3G in US.

I have read on many blogs and forums that USA does not have a robust 3G network.

Originally Posted by infra_red_dude

Actually to conserve battery life they couldn've excluded the camera, wifi etc. All these hog battery more than "3G"!

I wish that Apple had chosen to do away with the camera but it is a huge selling point. Phones without cameras just don't sell so I guess Apple did not have any choice. As for Wi-Fi, well, it consumes less battery than 3G does and it is a much better option IMHO. You can have Wi-Fi anywhere. You don't need to depend on the network or carrier. I would prefer it to 3G any day.

Originally Posted by infra_red_dude

They don't need to "figure" out. They just need to release the models that were/are 3G ready

Alas, I think you are wrong. They need to figure out how to include it in that thin a device while having a good battery life. To quote Anand Lal Shimpi, "as 3G deployments become even more widespread and technology improves you can expect to see lower power and more tightly integrated 3G chipsets available." I think they are waiting for that time. This is what I meant when I said that they need to figure it out.

Originally Posted by infra_red_dude

I fully agree with you regarding this. Every bit!

I fully agree with myself regarding this too. Every bit!

Originally Posted by infra_red_dude

My cuz recently bought an iPod Touch and I must say that the exprience of using it in itself is an amazing one. As the Mac Guys say, the iPhone has nothing "new" but the way we "do" things on it is different. And I agree to each word of theirs

And it is exactly the same feeling with Mac OS X. It does not do better things, it does things in better ways.

Originally Posted by desiibond

3G iphone is just a marketing tactic. Put 3G and increase the price further. Increase the profits.

First release phone without 3G. Then put 3G on it and increase the price.

I can bet you anything the price of iPhone v2.0 will either be the same as it is now or it will be decreased. There is no chance of the price getting hiked. Apple never increases the prices when it upgrades its products, be it Macs or iPods, and now the iPhone. Standard Apple policy.

Originally Posted by gx_saurav

Right, what about all other phones which support 3G fine?

They either make other tradeoffs or have a crappy battery life.

Originally Posted by gx_saurav

U R wrong, in USA 3G Is there more then Europe.

LOL!

Are you never tired of being so blatantly wrong!

Originally Posted by gx_saurav

Starbucks isn't available in India yet

All you need to do to have a Wi-Fi connection is buy a Rs. 2,000 Wi-Fi router. You don't need Starbucks for the Wi-Fi!

[goobimama]

I forgot how amazing the iPhone looks... look at the UI! It looks so cool!

[narangz]

Yes, 3G affects battery life. But it is a lame excuse! If I want to use 3G Network & it consumes more battery than standard GSM/CDMA signal then it's my problem!

If Apple is so concerned about that then why it is going to support 3G in iPhone v2? I mean its the worst excuse I ever heard. iLie!

^^ N95 looks a lot better! Atleast to me!

[iMav]

3g affects battery the same as cell fone applications take down the network

[narangz]

^^

Well Manan it really affects battery life You may check any Nokia phone's manual which has 3G. However how much it affects actually depends on the network, 3G Applications like Video Calls, Data transfer. So that low battery life actually seems good to me

[infra_red_dude]

Originally Posted by aryayush

Look at this thread. Read the second post. Turning 3G off on the N95 saves a lot of battery.

I haf said it earlier and say it again that giving the reason that 3G is a hogger and hence we didn't include it, is a lame reason. You cannot compare an iPhone with N95 and say it gives 8 hours backup while N95 gives only half of it. N95 has 3G, 5mp cam, video rec. etc. In the quest to reign supremacy you gotta do all that others do albeit with less resources.

Its really lame to say that if I remove the camera module, mp3 support, java VM (KVM) etc. from my W700i it will give me battery backup equivelent to that of N1100!

Breakthroughs and innovations happen when with the limited resources something extraordinary is achieved. Moto Razr V3m has 3G. You can see how slim it is yet gives great battery backup. What I mean to say is that its not difficult to integrate 3G in existing iPhone. I fully agree to the point that it has more memory, larger screen, wifi, faster proc. etc. which are battery hoggers. I hope you get the point I wanna make

Originally Posted by aryayush

I wish that Apple had chosen to do away with the camera but it is a huge selling point. Phones without cameras just don't sell so I guess Apple did not have any choice. As for Wi-Fi, well, it consumes less battery than 3G does and it is a much better option IMHO. You can have Wi-Fi anywhere. You don't need to depend on the network or carrier. I would prefer it to 3G any day.

Picture this: You are travelling in a car or a train, you are at a picnic spot etc. WiFi or 3G? (Of corz subject to the network). What I mean to say is that the coverage area is substaintially more. Anyways, its irrelevant in our context

Originally Posted by aryayush

Alas, I think you are wrong. They need to figure out how to include it in that thin a device while having a good battery life. To quote Anand Lal Shimpi, "as 3G deployments become even more widespread and technology improves you can expect to see lower power and more tightly integrated 3G chipsets available." I think they are waiting for that time. This is what I meant when I said that they need to figure it out.

You think 3G transreceivers are matchbox sized??

Quoting your own words here, which can be modified a bit for this context:

Originally Posted by aryayush

"If you always wait for the next price cut or to buy the new improved model, you'll never buy any technology product because there is always something better and less expensive on the horizon."

Originally Posted by gx_saurav

U R wrong, in USA 3G Is there more then Europe.

The thread was getting kinda boring. Thanks for cracking a joke!

[aryayush]

Originally Posted by infra_red_dude

I haf said it earlier and say it again that giving the reason that 3G is a hogger and hence we didn't include it, is a lame reason. You cannot compare an iPhone with N95 and say it gives 8 hours backup while N95 gives only half of it. N95 has 3G, 5mp cam, video rec. etc. In the quest to reign supremacy you gotta do all that others do albeit with less resources.

Its really lame to say that if I remove the camera module, mp3 support, java VM (KVM) etc. from my W700i it will give me battery backup equivelent to that of N1100!

Breakthroughs and innovations happen when with the limited resources something extraordinary is achieved. Moto Razr V3m has 3G. You can see how slim it is yet gives great battery backup. What I mean to say is that its not difficult to integrate 3G in existing iPhone. I fully agree to the point that it has more memory, larger screen, wifi, faster proc. etc. which are battery hoggers. I hope you get the point I wanna make

I do, but I still think I am right and that we are going around in circles. N95 compromises on the battery life to include 3G, the Motorola phone compromises on the screen size and Wi-Fi to include 3G and the iPhone compromises on the 3G to give you a great battery life, Wi-Fi and a brilliant screen.

What I am trying to say is that you have to make certain tradeoffs and IMHO, a great battery life is far more important on a phone than super fast access to the Internet all the time. I hate my Nokia 6300 just because of the crappy battery life.

You have to prioritise. In Apple's opinion and in mine, battery life is the priority. In yours, maybe 3G is the priority. All I'm trying to say is that the original statement by eggman, "3G was always there and was no big deal in providing it" is wrong. It is a big deal because it affects the battery life and the size. Yes, Apple could have included it but then the world would have been griping about the battery life and its size. You just cannot satisfy everyone.

Originally Posted by infra_red_dude

Picture this: You are travelling in a car or a train, you are at a picnic spot etc. WiFi or 3G? (Of corz subject to the network). What I mean to say is that the coverage area is substaintially more. Anyways, its irrelevant in our context

I am in my home far more often than I am out on a picnic. And the iPhone does have EDGE, in case you missed it.


And just for the sake of full disclosure, let me be very clear that though I do think that the exclusion of 3G from the first generation of the iPhone was not a bad decision and am defending it, I am not entirely satisfied with the phone myself and am going to wait for the second generation before I buy one.

[iMav]

ok so now what is it .... smaller screen or compromise on battery or what to include 3g or steve jobs came up with some new 3g technology

[infra_red_dude]

Originally Posted by aryayush

Motorola phone compromises on the screen size and Wi-Fi to include 3G and the iPhone compromises on the 3G to give you a great battery life, Wi-Fi and a brilliant screen.

What I mean to say is that inspite of including the 3G transreceiver, it is still "Razr" thin!

Originally Posted by aryayush

N95 compromises on the battery life to include 3G

Again, what I said was even with all these features it gives a decent 4 hour backup. How much backup would be lost with the inclusion of 3G in the iPhone? I'm no iPhone engineer, I can only speculate. But surely it won't eat up those "extra 4 hours" of battery life iPhone provides.

Mebbe inclusion would've sucked some battery power resulting in "only 6 hours" backup. Now that doesn't seem too big an advantage over "4 hours of backup on N95". But with exclusion of 3G they claim an 8 hour battery life and hence can market it as "double the battery backup than N95!" Hope you get my point.

Originally Posted by aryayush

You just cannot satisfy everyone.

Very true

Originally Posted by aryayush

I am in my home far more often than I am out on a picnic.

You don't represent the "entire" customer base.

Originally Posted by aryayush

And the iPhone does have EDGE, in case you missed it.

Yup, I know it.

Since 3G has li'l significance in India and I'm not a "potential" iPhone customer for at least an year now, neither you are (I suppose), I quote your first line here and end the discussion on "3G in iPhone"

Originally Posted by aryayush

.... that we are going around in circles.

[aryayush]

Yeah, let us just agree to disagree.

[ax3]

may b i will wait 4 iphone version 4 ......... in future though .....

bt this is nice news 2 .........

[faraaz]

Post deleted for obvious reasons...

Sorry arya