Should frames be used in HTML designing?

[tuxfan]

Just need some quality opinions. Should frames be used in web pages?

I have read at some places that frames should not be used and some places recommending frames. Earlier things were different because there were browsers that didn't support frames. But now there is no such problem.

Additionally, it saves bandwidth and increases speed by downloading only those portion that needs to refresh.

[desertwind]

Frame ofcourse saves bandwidth, but really is a bad design. I usually use tables instead.

[icecoolz]

depends. There are times when frames cannot be avoided. Frames do increase bandwidth as there are as many calls as there are no of frames when you load up the first time. I think there needs to be a careful balance of frames being used. If only one section of a page need be refreshed then using frames is better.

[Ricky]

Ricky Suggested:

Avoid as much as you can.

[sms_solver]

Avoid frames, many good websites never use frames!! It is old-fashioned now

[shwetanshu]

yeah frames make a webpage look crappy. Avoid them if u can

[Deep]

I prefer avoid using frames....basic use of frame is to include common pages which can be done by using SSI or PHP includes...

Frames are kind of bad for search engines...because in frames you will have only 1 page and content of the links will be shown inside the frames so search engines will scan inside pages which you do not want to get displayed withouht the frames..

Deep

[cvvikram]

Yes one should try to avoid the frames ...since it not preferred by websites...there are many alternatives to it...

[Ricky]

hmm..

Frames are indeed useful, everything in world has some reason and sometimes its wiser to use frames than page.

It really depends on your efficiency.

[gdatuk]

try the new layout grid in golvie cs2

[it_waaznt_me]

I say dont use Frames .. infact iframes arent good thing too ... They are hard to manage (yes they are ) .. search engine crawlers dont like them .. and on the top of all they look amatuerish ..

Use Css .. best bet ..

[tuxfan]

Originally Posted by Deep

basic use of frame is to include common pages which can be done by using SSI or PHP includes...

Can you throw some more light on this? Do you mean the include() function of PHP?

Originally Posted by it_waaznt_me

Use Css .. best bet ..

I went to 8 computer book shops that I know (Lamington Road, VT and Girgaon). None of them had any books on CSS :roll: At one place I found the CSS Cookbook by O'reilly. But nothing great. I will have to rely on online resources only. I don't prefer that much. I at least need an ebook Does anyone have one?

Originally Posted by gdatuk

try the new layout grid in golvie cs2

What's golvie cs2?

[desertwind]

Originally Posted by tuxfan

Can you throw some more light on this? Do you mean the include() function of PHP?

yes, The include() statement includes and evaluates the specified file. its like calling and executing another php file within a php file.

http://in2.php.net/function.include

[go4saket]

Try to avoid frames to the extent possible. Two biggest problems are No.1 : Search engine robots are not much comfortable with sites using frames and so they just skip such sites. Thus you will never find yourself on a search engine. No.2 : You will have to make a frameset for every webpage of yours, or else if the user wants to go directly to a webpage and not to your index page, he/she will reach that particular webpage but there your frame wont be visible, thereby spoiling all your efforts.
If you are not much comfortable using tables, try using Layers. Its the simplest way to design a webpage.

[Deep]

Tuxfan, by SSI I meant using apache Server Side Includes which can be used in shtml pages.

You can also use PHP includes the effect will be same.

About CSS, actually you wont find books in India but on Amazon they have good colleciton of books...

Book Web Standards Solution is a good book to understand web standards and basic CSS..

I have written review on it, if you want then you can check it out here, there is one more good book for CSS called Zen of CSS but it is more of case studies and it is for the guys who know CSS well...

You can also checkout some articles on Sitepoint, they have good collection of articles on CSS, you can also check out sites like CSS Zen Garden (check out their resources section too)

For asking css doubts in forums, Sitepoint forums is the best place, full of CSS experts...

I hope this helps you.
Regards
Deep

[tuxfan]

Purchasing books on Amazon is a pretty costly affair. Is it possible to borrow the books from you Deep? I can guaratee that they will be returned without any damage.

I have been thru these sites even earlier. But I was just trying to find something that goes from start to finish rather than tell me somethings here and there. I know CSS somewhat, but its different to master it. I have CSS2 reference saved from w3schools and use it often. Keep trying and evolving. But a definitive guide is always better.

A search at google for CSS hasn't given me much. I was going thru the results for almost an hour.

[Deep]

Hi,
Actually those books belong to my ex-compny, I always used to ask them to get new books to keep in touch with new stuff in web design (though I am not a designer but I love to read those kind of books)

I will look around for some ebooks for u and let u know...

Deep

[tuxfan]

Thanks Deep, I have got your mail with links.

I can now say that I am not a total newbie at CSS. I took the CSS quiz at w3schools and scored 20/20 8) . I need to have lots of tips and tricks from experienced users/authors. I have knowledge, I need guidance on how best to implement it.