New PC Build for 3D Creation & Rendering

[pcforumguy]

Hi Guys,
It's my first ever thread on thinkdigit (which is very informative as well as helpful thread) and hope will be posting frequently....! As a newbie plz forgive me if I not get anything right or putting it in right words.

So, without wasting time....which I am doing right now....here is my questionnaire -

1. What is the purpose of the computer? What all applications and games are you going to run? (Stupid answers like 'gaming' or 'office work' will not work. Be exact. Which games? Which applications? Avoid the word 'et cetera.')
Ans: Will use this PC for -
3D Creation apps like 3D Max, Maya, Cinema4D etc.
3D Rendering apps like V-Ray, FryRender, Maxwell etc.
Photoshop
Games...rarely, but yes....NFS Carbon, EOE, Hitman 3/4/5 something like that


2. What is your overall budget? If you can extend a bit for a more balanced configuration, then mention this too.
Ans: Around 55-60k including Taxes...but not over 60k.


3. Planning to overclock?
Ans: If it's going to help in 3D Rendering then yes. (can anyone explain a bit on this subject, OC helpful or not?)


4. Which Operating System are you planning to use?
Ans: Windows 7/8 and Linux Mint 12 (Gnome3) as dual boot PC.


5. How much hard drive space is needed?
Ans:1] Single 1TB or 500GB+500GB ...... I have read somewhere, it's good idea to use two different solid drives to speed up operations during 3D Creation.


6. Do you want to buy a monitor? If yes, please mention which screen size and resolution do you want. If you already have a monitor and want to reuse it, again mention the size and resolution of monitor you have.
Ans:Yes, want to buy new monitor about 20-22'' LED


7. Which components you DON'T want to buy or which components you already have and plan on reusing?
Ans:Maybe Speakers & UPS I will retain to myself.


8. When are you planning to buy the system?
Ans: Within 1-2 weeks. To be exact before 10 March 2012.......this date may change if any news on Finance Minister of India announce tax cutoff on PC parts....


9. Have you ever built a desktop before or will this be done by an assembler?
Ans:Assembler....But I will watch pretty closely so I will do myself next time


10. Where do you live? Are you buying locally? Are you open to buying stuff from online shops if you don't get locally?
Ans: I live in Nashik, Maharashtra - 200Km from Mumbai/Pune.
Buying locally .... Yes, just to avoid any after sale services problem.
Online shopping .... Yes, if their is no other option. I can go to Mumbai/Pune if required (just mention exact address of the shop).



11. Anything else which you would like to say?
Ans: My current rig is - P4 3Ghz/Intel 915GAV/512MB RAM/No GPU/80GB SATA/CD-DVD Combo/2.1 Speakers etc........basically a STONE AGED PC which is with me for last uhh....5 yrs. BUT to be frank this is a Bare-Bone rig for me...it last without any single problem till today

So, I am very Optimistic or say Naive about my near future PC. I hope it will last with me at least 2-3 yrs. But I will upgrade it time to time in this 2-3 yrs.so, plz keep that in mind when anyone suggest about new config.

Actually I have done some online research (mainly on Intel part) and this what I think -
Intel -


AMD -

As I mentioned above 'I have done some online research.....' what I mean that I don't know the actual prices on street; That's why I don't mentioned any prices of the components.
But surely I want know, Is my config is in my budget of Rs.55-60K ?

Waiting for suggestions !
Thanks !

[whitestar_999]

intel config with 2600/2600k is much more powerful.also hard disc prices are very high currently(almost double of previous normal rates).you are confusing high performing SSD(solid state drive)with conventional mechanical drives(which most people use).SSD prices right now are nowhere near the cost/GB of conventional mechanical drives(a good 60GB SSD will cost ~5000 same as a conventional 1TB which used to cost ~2600 a few months ago).i am not familiar with 3d rendering but as far as i know processor is the most important component & many softwares use relatively very little gpu compared to processor.

[Mr.V]

I dont think so the 2600k config will come in your budget.
If it comes,then well and good,if not,Go for the bulldozer 8120 (if possible 8150)
It has 8 cores and will help in heavy rendering of photos and animated videos in HD or Full HD.

Use CPU cooler only if you are planning to overclock
What is overclocking?
Overclocking is the process of making a computer or component operate faster than specified by the manufacturer by modifying system parameters. One of the most important techniques is running at a higher clock rate (more clock cycles per second, Operating voltages may also be changed (increased), which can increase the speed at which operation remains stable. Most overclocking techniques increase power consumption, generating more heat which increases temperatures and must be carried away.
WARNING! :- MAY DAMAGE YOUR COMPONENTS IF OVERCLOCKED AT HIGH RATES.
So a good PSU and cooler is needed. (Hyper evo 212 is good! )

I am a 3DS Max user,and seriously i dont think to overclock my 8120 as it results in unnecessary heat.Yes,you may get a performance gain.


Total:- a little over 60000
If graphics are not a high priority,then change it to 6850 or 6870.It may keep your prices down.
Prices checked at ebay.in
If you do not overclock,then the stock cooler is enough!

[whitestar_999]

total:59400

[pcforumguy]

Thanks for reply guys.

.....you are confusing high performing SSD(solid state drive)with conventional mechanical drives(which most people use).SSD prices right now are nowhere near the cost/GB of conventional mechanical drives(a good 60GB SSD will cost ~5000 same as a conventional 1TB which used to cost ~2600 a few months ago)

Just for clarification, yes I know what SSD and HDD are. When I wrote 'HDD : Any High Perfomance 1TB.....' it means HDD at 7200rpm-64MB Cache or 6GB/s etc.

.....It has 8 cores and will help in heavy rendering of photos and animated videos in HD or Full HD.

Yes it has 4 physical extra core than i2500/2500k/2600k's either physical or virtual; But Bulldozer's PER CORE PERFORMANCE is not that up to mark as these Intel's guys have. It's not mine test or knowledge, it's what I read on various reviews & forums. i.e. MaximumPC, AnandTech, Toms Hardware etc.
And I want CPU that has up to mark performance for fast rendering times.

I am a 3DS Max user,and seriously i dont think to overclock my 8120 as it results in unnecessary heat.Yes,you may get a performance gain.

You don't ever try to OC your FX8120? Does it relate to AMD's heat generation problem? What performance gain you or anyone can expect if OC ? (I am not forcing you to do this, just a query)

[OSxSnowLeopard]

Just get a good cpu and amount of ram(ram specs and speed doesn't matter in this field). Get 6-8gb, it's a must for your system or performance will suffer directly as soon as your 3d software starts consuming it(get 6gigs 1333mhz rams they are cheap). It also doen't matter here how much you spend on gpu while working on heavy projects they all will come to their knees. So don't spend more than 10-12k on gpu( only if you want to game then its a good excuse to get one). If you are a doing complete project(from scratch to end which includes post production work), then buy a good monitor(eips atleast big no to tn). Only this setup will help. If you are setting up for professional work. SSD's will not affect your performance at all during working or rendering.

P.S: try to avoid oc setup if projects taking hrs to render.

[azaad_shri75]

total:59400

where are you getting i7 2600k for 16.5k ?

[Mr.V]

Thanks for reply guys.





Yes it has 4 physical extra core than i2500/2500k/2600k's either physical or virtual; But Bulldozer's PER CORE PERFORMANCE is not that up to mark as these Intel's guys have. It's not mine test or knowledge, it's what I read on various reviews & forums. i.e. MaximumPC, AnandTech, Toms Hardware etc.
And I want CPU that has up to mark performance for fast rendering times.


You don't ever try to OC your FX8120? Does it relate to AMD's heat generation problem? What performance gain you or anyone can expect if OC ? (I am not forcing you to do this, just a query)

I see that the per core performance is not great.I could have gone for the i7 2600k,But no.I didnt go.Why? because in rendering,all cores are used.The processor uses the good old saying "UNITED WE STAND,DIVIDED WE FALL" .When the processor works with all cores together,it really becomes a monster.(you may not see in benchmarks.)But when they are divided,no power! .Our 3DS max takes the max juice out of cores. In my institution,The core i5 2500k takes upto 30 secs to render just 10 frames.Here at home,it less then 10 seconds.Adobe premier too will show you almost same results.
In photoshop,While editing,SSD will help you a lot (also in 3ds max ) .But i suggest you wait till the prices come down.

I dunno why the bulldozer is suppressed.In multimedia,its good.

About OC,No there is no heat problem.Its just that i donnot want to risk my components. I want to last them as long as pssible.(maybe i play around with my old pentium computer! )



Thats all i got to say abt your queries.

total:59400

Seasonic 620w is around 5500
Mobo is for around 10k
Core i7 18k

Correct prices --'

[pcforumguy]

I dunno why the bulldozer is suppressed.In multimedia,its good.
......In photoshop,While editing,SSD will help you a lot (also in 3ds max ) .But i suggest you wait till the prices come down.

That's exactly what I think !
When do you think prices of HDD or SSD's will cme down?

About OC what I think and what I learned from so much reviews is, If you don't OC your CPU then there is no point to spending extra money on mobo which is capble of OC; Just get good stable and reliable mobo is good enough.


How does FX 8150-FX8120's physical cores stand in front of i7's physical + virtual cores combination ? How does it affect on rendering, which as we know CPU hungry process ?

[whitestar_999]

SeaSonic S12II 620 Bronze 620W ATX12V V2.3 / EPS 12V V2.91 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply

i7 2600k price is from cost2cost nehru place list.prices on online sites for processor/mobo etc are always ~1000-1500 more.

How does FX 8150-FX8120's physical cores stand in front of i7's physical + virtual cores combination ? How does it affect on rendering, which as we know CPU hungry process ?

even FX8150 does not come close to 2600k.if you have the budget there is no better AMD processor than i7 2600k.
AnandTech - The Bulldozer Review: AMD FX-8150 Tested
AnandTech - The Sandy Bridge Review: Intel Core i7-2600K, i5-2500K and Core i3-2100 Tested

@Mr.V there is something wrong with your institute i5 2500k system if it is slower than 8120(see links above).i know people who even managed to slow down their i7 2600 systems by installing junk/incorrect settings.

[arora.prafull]

Hello,

I am also from same field ! I would suggest you to get a quadro fx graphic card.
It takes less rendering time than others, and the best quality.
That means you'll get vRay photorealistic images in less time and best quality.
These graphic card are built for mainly rendering purpose. Games like NFS Run and COD MW4 are not possible in it. But your games will run perfectly, Also in animation industry all studios are using nVidea Quadro Fx.

Quadro 380 will suit to your budget. Thats my openion.

Thanks.

-----------------
See my Rig thread

[OSxSnowLeopard]

Hello,

I am also from same field ! I would suggest you to get a quadro fx graphic card.
It takes less rendering time than others, and the best quality.
That means you'll get vRay photorealistic images in less time and best quality.
These graphic card are built for mainly rendering purpose. Games like NFS Run and COD MW4 are not possible in it. But your games will run perfectly, Also in animation industry all studios are using nVidea Quadro Fx.

Quadro 380 will suit to your budget. Thats my openion.

Thanks.

-----------------
See my Rig thread

Hey bro you need to clear some basics.-) This isn't how it works like you really think by mistake or due to any sort of confusion.

[arora.prafull]

^^
All what I know, is Animation Studios use this graphic cards for faster rendering and best output. They are not Morons !

[Mr.V]

SeaSonic S12II 620 Bronze 620W ATX12V V2.3 / EPS 12V V2.91 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply

i7 2600k price is from cost2cost nehru place list.prices on online sites for processor/mobo etc are always ~1000-1500 more.


even FX8150 does not come close to 2600k.if you have the budget there is no better AMD processor than i7 2600k.
AnandTech - The Bulldozer Review: AMD FX-8150 Tested
AnandTech - The Sandy Bridge Review: Intel Core i7-2600K, i5-2500K and Core i3-2100 Tested

@Mr.V there is something wrong with your institute i5 2500k system if it is slower than 8120(see links above).i know people who even managed to slow down their i7 2600 systems by installing junk/incorrect settings.

Actually the institution had the computer before mine!
I tried to assemble the same piece with same graphics.
But i changed and that too the same config but different processor.
I myself saw the difference.
I dont go on benchmarks but i go only and only on experience.

Core i7 may beat fx8150 is gaming but it still lags behind in heavy rendering and work

A new update for windows 7 has been released by microsoft for bulldozer.It improves the performance as before,it just gave one thread per module (a module contains 2 cores)

[OSxSnowLeopard]

Surely workstaion gpu will give you little edge over consumer market gpu's, but again gpu's are know way involved in 3d rendering, they somewhat help in video projects. Why some one will buy low end workstation gpu over gaming gpu is just due to they way it work or handel task over the normal gpu. Moreover it provide 10bit color Channel for graphic pros those who wants to go deep inside the properties of color corrections. For this you need a display like hp dream color, Nec pa**** or similar display with capability of showing 10bit color information(mostly) with display port connection support and none of these display comes below 30-40k. I'm not calling any institute any way directly or indirectly moron. So peace.-)

[pcforumguy]

Hi Guys,
I think every one have posted here_on this thread_just forgotten about i7 2600, which just like twin brother of i7 2600k except it's not fully OC, it has less powerful integrated Graphics Model (it's not a point of concern, i think)and 2-2.5k cheaper.Compare Intel® Products

I think it's in-the-middle of the road from price wise ; Well as I mentioned earlier,If you don't OC (which I think most of the people don't do) your CPU then there is no point to spending extra money on mobo which is capble of OC; Just get good stable and reliable mobo is good enough.In that way you (and me too) can save money on both CPU and Motherboard.

But how much can I save on-the-street? En-light me

[pcforumguy]

Well I am still waiting to be Enlighten ......never mind still waiting.

On the AMD FX8150/8120 subject, I found an article over the net that has an solid (not just Benchmark Review or hyperbolic sideways of either Intel or AMD) explanation of the 'low' performance of FX 8150/8120 delivering even these are 8 core 'monsters' .
Analyzing Bulldozer: Why AMD’s chip is so disappointing | ExtremeTech

Just a quick check -

We checked the impact of Windows 7′s scheduler by measuring CPU performance in Maxwell Render 1.7 and Cinebench 11.5. Both programs allow the user to define a specific number of threads (four, in our case). The 4M/8C label means that all eight cores are active, 4M/4C means that all four modules are active, with one core operating per module, and 2M/4C denotes a dual-module/quad-core configuration. Both of these tests show a 4M/4C arrangement outperforming a 4M/8C system by roughly eight percent when four threads are used. This suggests that scheduler inefficiencies could indeed be hurting Bulldozer’s general performance in workloads that can’t take advantage of all eight cores.

AND

Maxwell Render is one of the only tests where Bulldozer demonstrates a native performance advantage over Thuban. There are applications where Bulldozer shines — just not many of them.

It's a confusion. isn't it?
Any opinion ?

[vickybat]

Actually the institution had the computer before mine!
I tried to assemble the same piece with same graphics.
But i changed and that too the same config but different processor.
I myself saw the difference.
I dont go on benchmarks but i go only and only on experience.

Core i7 may beat fx8150 is gaming but it still lags behind in heavy rendering and work

Your posts are misleading to be honest. Give reasons and proof to justify your points.

Currently 2600k is unbeatable in price/performance ratio. Amd doesn't have a single cpu to challenge it.

@pcforumguy

Stick with 2600k. It delivers faster rendering times than 8150 any day. Overclocking 2600k raises the performance bar sky due to its superior ipc which bulldozer lacks terribly. Read neutral and genuine review sites.

[pcforumguy]

Stick with 2600k. It delivers faster rendering times than 8150 any day. Overclocking 2600k raises the performance bar sky due to its superior ipc which bulldozer lacks terribly. Read neutral and genuine review sites.

Thanks vickybat !
Well, I think I am doing it.....but the Reviews were leading me to get confuseed.Take an example of above mentioned review - On 1st page they downgraded AMD FX8150 and on 3rd page they thumbs up for it.
And it's not a single review like that (to get confused), there is lot of sites which are Neutral and Genuine like AnandTech, MaximumPC, TomsHadrware, TweakTown etc. They all saying same thing, it's not a BAD processor but it's not up to mark in most of the Real World Applications; And it's average out in some applications (mostly multi-threaded, as far as I grab-it right ).

Thanks !

[sumonpathak]

Well...having reviewed the FX 8150 a few days ago..i would say getting a FX would be better at this point...as long as FPU calculation are not involved the FX still kicks ass...much to the frustration of Intel guys...

[pcforumguy]

Hi Guys,

I think I should wait till end of April 2012.......why?

Well I really think that i7 2600k + z68 is an EXPENSIVE () deal for me.
And there is new news (of course for me), i7 3770/k will coming in April'12 and more importantly it's going to be CHEAP than i7 2600k (is it?).
The i7 3770/k will be 10-15% faster than i7 2600/k as per lots of Neutral and Genuine reviews like this one - Intel Releases Ivy Bridge Chip Performance Numbers - Legit Reviews

What you think ? Should I wait or not ?

[whitestar_999]

if i7 2600k+z68 mobo is expensive for you now then i7 3770k+z68 mobo too will be expensive for you.

[pcforumguy]

if i7 2600k+z68 mobo is expensive for you now then i7 3770k+z68 mobo too will be expensive for you.

What about i7 3770 + z68 ?
And how much in ur opinion ?

Expensive = Per Core Performance for the price.

[whitestar_999]

no idea but i7 3770 is supposed to be a replacement for existing i7 2600 which means price most probably will be higher than current i7 2600(since latest tech).also z68 is only needed for "k" series processors so for 3770 z68 is not required.

[pcforumguy]

no idea but i7 3770 is supposed to be a replacement for existing i7 2600 which means price most probably will be higher than current i7 2600(since latest tech).also z68 is only needed for "k" series processors so for 3770 z68 is not required.

OK !
If, i7 3770 is going to be replacement for i7 2600, means i7 2600's prices will drop down (I am really hoping for this ).

I have mentioned i7 3770 + z68, b'cause if I want to upgrade my system in future, then I will have an option with Z68 - i.e. i7 3770K or anything beyond that. (Correct me If I am wrong)

And what you think about - i7 2600 ? Again should I go with Z68 (future upgrade) or any other mobo (non OC) ?

[whitestar_999]

not right away but yes current i7 prices will come down a bit.also by the time you feel the need to upgrade your 3770/2600 to a "k" series(at least 3 years as you are after all spending 17000 on a processor)6 cores probably be the norm & z68/sandy bridge/ivy bridge will be long gone.

[pcforumguy]

not right away but yes current i7 prices will come down a bit.also by the time you feel the need to upgrade your 3770/2600 to a "k" series(at least 3 years as you are after all spending 17000 on a processor)6 cores probably be the norm & z68/sandy bridge/ivy bridge will be long gone.

Thanks buddy !
It's the suggestion is what I am waiting for.....which don't confuse me and more practical.

Ok, it's looks like a roller-coaster ride of the opinions but can't help with it... -
I don't willing to take a risk to OC my new rig and hence I think it's better to go with i7 2600 instead of K version of it.

Can anyone suggest me good motherboard for i7 2600 for good stability and performance.Should I still go for Z68 or not? Then which one ?

[whitestar_999]

buying a z68 mobo for a non-k processor is not recommended.H67 mobo from intel is good for its price(DH67CLB3 for ~5400).you can also look for H67 based mobo from asus & gigabyte but intel one is recommended by many for its price & performance.just make sure you get B3 version as earlier versions have sata problems.

[ico]

Hello,

I am also from same field ! I would suggest you to get a quadro fx graphic card.
It takes less rendering time than others, and the best quality.
That means you'll get vRay photorealistic images in less time and best quality.
These graphic card are built for mainly rendering purpose. Games like NFS Run and COD MW4 are not possible in it. But your games will run perfectly, Also in animation industry all studios are using nVidea Quadro Fx.

Quadro 380 will suit to your budget. Thats my openion.

Thanks.

-----------------
See my Rig thread

I'll clear one thing for you. If you are comparing a a Fermi-based nVidia consumer GPU (GTX 400/500) with a Fermi-based Quadro, Fermi-based Quadro will be much much faster. Reason? nVidia has crippled the 3ds Max/Maya viewport performance of the consumer driver. So, that people go for Quadro and nVidia makes a lot more $$$$$$.

GTX series and Quadro are essentially the same chip. Ever wondered?

AMD gives FirePro (professional) and Radeon (consumer). Radeon's performance in Maya/3ds Max Viewports might be slightly low compared to FirePro, but they aren't crippled by AMD in any sense. it's just that FirePro drivers are more stable and fine tuned for renderring apps.

My suggestion for you, instead of wasting money on a Quadro, pick up an AMD Radeon graphic card.

Heck, pick up a FirePro instead of Quadro if you are too "professional" tag conscious. Quadros are only better in price tags which don't matter. FirePro V7900 is almost a Quadro 5000. and HD 6950 is almost a V7900 minus a stable "professional" driver.

Every thing said and done, AMD graphic cards can power 4 monitors at once - more work space. nVidia (whether GTX or Quadro) can only power two in general.

Thanks buddy !
It's the suggestion is what I am waiting for.....which don't confuse me and more practical.

Ok, it's looks like a roller-coaster ride of the opinions but can't help with it... -
I don't willing to take a risk to OC my new rig and hence I think it's better to go with i7 2600 instead of K version of it.

Can anyone suggest me good motherboard for i7 2600 for good stability and performance.Should I still go for Z68 or not? Then which one ?

I'm replying in reference to your e-mail.

No. Go for i7-2600K only.

My suggestion is this:
Intel i7-2600K
Asus P8Z68-V Gen 3

Why K? Simply because you'll be bale to overclock it after two-three years down the line if you think it isn't fast enough any more. For a difference of Rs. 1500, it's better to get the K version only. To even it out, let's be practical and spend less on the cabinet. NZXT Gamma for Rs. 2200 is fine. Hard Disk prices are very high at the moment, so buying anything more than 500 GB doesn't make sense for me.

Differences between all chipsets of Intel are explained here - http://www.thinkdigit.com/forum/cpu-...rd-thread.html

I'll be honest, multi-threaded performance of FX-8120 is between i5-2500K and i7-2600K. I waited for FX-8120 to get launched and didn't buy it because of its power consumption. Power consumption will make a difference if you are going to keep your processor stressed for long periods. FX-8120 a good processor for its price though. But AMD hasn't got their new architecture completely right.

Spending extra on i7-2600K is justified over i5-2500K for your purpose imho.

Second, if you want to get a graphic card, buy AMD HD 7850/7870 after they come in India and prices get settled. GPU will be needed when you run Viewports in Maya/3ds max.

[pcforumguy]

I'm replying in reference to your e-mail.

No. Go for i7-2600K only.

My suggestion is this:
Intel i7-2600K
Asus P8Z68-V Gen 3

Thanks ico !