Piracy and anti piracy in India

[detoknight]

India is a breeding ground for piracy.

It says here that 65% of all software used is pirated.
http://trak.in/tags/business/2010/05...-piracy-india/

This report places India as the fourth largest global hub of online film piracy
http://www.cis-india.org/advocacy/ip...-studies-india

What are your views on online film piracy and anti-piracy.

for eg: Britain has The three strikes Law

In many countries, they have anti p2p organizations, stringent laws etc..
Sometimes, downloaders get letters for copyright infringement.They get heavily fined.
what has India got? Can the government even track people who are downloading using torrents etc..?

[rhitwick]

First need is getting basic "Law and Order" in order. Piracy is still not a threat India.

Real threats are Terrorists, Naxals, Maos and others. We are not that rich in resources that we can deploy so much manpower for anti-piracy only.

[Gauravs90]

Originally Posted by detoknight

It says here that 65% of all software used is pirated.
http://trak.in/tags/business/2010/05...-piracy-india/

NoI asume it's 90%. I haven't seen anyone till now who's using a genuine paid software.

In those 90% people 50% dosen't know that they have to pay for the software they are using, they always insist on pirated office, windows OS,Nero,PowerDVD,Anti Virus etc. etc. etc. cause their vendors install them for free.

If i ask them if they have money they can go for genuine I get only reply 'DHAT'

[gagan007]

Originally Posted by Gauravs90

NoI asume it's 90%. I haven't seen anyone till now who's using a genuine paid software.

I wonder where do you live my friend...a village! (no offence meant, just pun intended!)
You are saying that the report published by two foremost organisations is wrong and your assumption is right (BTW assume breaks up into "a$$"+"u"+"me" so never assume)...hehe

All, in my friend circle, have genuine softwares (OS atleast) or they use freewares whenever required...
thanks to Digit that they have initiated a revolution by spreading awareness through various articles published by them...because of which I stopped using pirated s/w long ago. What's more, I know that I am not alone...you will find hundreds like me in this forum

[Gauravs90]

Originally Posted by gagan007

I wonder where do you live my friend...a village! (no offence meant, just pun intended!)
You are saying that the report published by two foremost organisations is wrong and your assumption is right (BTW assume breaks up into "a$$"+"u"+"me" so never assume)...hehe

All, in my friend circle, have genuine softwares (OS atleast) or they use freewares whenever required...
thanks to Digit that they have initiated a revolution by spreading awareness through various articles published by them...because of which I stopped using pirated s/w long ago. What's more, I know that I am not alone...you will find hundreds like me in this forum

I said that I assume not that I really meant it it may be more or less but i never believe these organization fully. how can they say that it's only 65% users use pirated software how can they calculate?. There's no fool proof method of doing correct survey.They do only for publicity that's all.

[sujoyp]

Yaah thats correct that nowdays max people use genuine OS...but thats it...90% of the MS Office used r pirated, photoshop, autocad, winzip,norton antivirus are the most common pirated software on anyones comp...

[gagan007]

no my friend...the scenario has changed....Open Office, GIMP, 7zip and Avast have taken place of pirated versions of softwares mentioned by you...

i agree that these surveys can never depict the actual picture but they are very close. do you think the census is 100% accurate, NO..but it reaches the actual number...
surveys like these are often targeted at a selected number of people...I am sure many of you have given surveys on MS, Nokia etc sites...apart from this data collected from many things you do...the online forms you fill (for registration) etc. is always used for similar purposes...which may not be accurate, but always close to it...

[rkneo11]

Companies like Microsoft have finally realised that providing their products at a more economical rate it the only way to tackle piracy.
With stricter anti-piracy laws and also crackdowns it makes more sense to shift to Open sourse software. Open Office caters to all the basic needs and also supports MS Office formats...
For day to day regular needs Irfanview with plugins and Paint .NET suffice as photo editors...
Windows Movie maker has a load of good features...
Avast 5 and Avira AntiVir kick the butts of premium AV Softwares...
With all this I think we must spread awareness of Opensource rather than piracy...

[hansraj]

guys there lies a simple answer.... MAC could not be pirated coz Apple never wanted that... the hardware based security and other features. Microsoft realises that piracy is providing it the publicity it wants without any additional cost. The day MS decides of making it a fort like OS its not difficult for them. This way, they target the commercial and popular org only if such org use pirated copies. For a person using pirated copy of MS office in a country like ours, its least of the concerns of MS.

Now its only left to you if you want to be morally correct or just be a part of piracy. It will take long for our gov to initiate a drive against piracy. There are much serious issues as brought out by rhitwick.

[sujoyp]

@gagan007...yaah as I am a IT graduate and knowledgeable user I now use gimp,irfan view,winrar,avira antivir....but 80% people I know still believe that a cracked Norton, winzip, Photoshop are the best one...and they have it

And yes if I install these freeware they say that I am giving then complicated and low quality software as they r used to the old pirated ones

[Aberforth]

I find the whole hype and hoopla about piracy quite distasteful. India is a country where people are still stuggling to survive on a day-to-day basis. It is a country where we don't have enough legal resources to fight real crimes - like rape, murder, robbery and the like. And then we have corporates whining they they are earning a little less because apparently, 'potential customers' are pirating softwares instead of buying them.

The same MNCs have no ethical standards when they exploit cheap labour in foreign countries, just because they can. So we Indians will extend the same courtesies to them, because WE can.

[gagan007]

I am sorry...I do not think that those who struggle to survive on a day-to-day basis have anything to do with piracy....poverty is a different issue altogether...
you cannot justify piracy like this (or anyway)...IMHO piracy is stealing...

[sujoyp]

Piracy is SHARING in India and not stealing

[celldweller1591]

Originally Posted by sujoyp

Piracy is SHARING in India and not stealing

is it ? I dont think so. Piracy is a crime in every respect. India has got other problems to deal with that's why Govt cant pay much attention to it. Latest Reports "PM says that we will not be able to handle Inflation till december this year". So see, Central Govt have their own priorities as already been stated above. IMO :-
Promote Opensource and Stop piracy !!!

[Liverpool_fan]

Originally Posted by sujoyp

Piracy is SHARING in India and not stealing

The laws are applicable here as well i.e. the EULA
I dont use the term stealing with piracy tbh. Stealing is when you take something from somebody. However piracy is more like breaking an agreement or something.
However no way it should be called "Sharing". Because you are insulting the meaning of the word "Sharing".

---------- Post added at 01:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:52 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Aberforth

I find the whole hype and hoopla about piracy quite distasteful.

It is distasteful indeed.

India is a country where people are still stuggling to survive on a day-to-day basis. It is a country where we don't have enough legal resources to fight real crimes - like rape, murder, robbery and the like.

Corporates can easily have legal resources themselves Nothing to do with fighting real crimes.

And then we have corporates whining they they are earning a little less because apparently, 'potential customers' are pirating softwares instead of buying them.

The corporates are just making excuses for the shareholders. It's a fact that piracy helps corporates to sell their software as their software is freely marketed by word of mouth.

The same MNCs have no ethical standards when they exploit cheap labour in foreign countries, just because they can. So we Indians will extend the same courtesies to them, because WE can.

And in turn because YOU CAN:
(1) Even if you don't pay for their software, you use them (for free apparently)
(2) Due to so many people using such software for FREE it almost becomes like a standard. Case in point: MS Office, Adobe Photoshop
(3) Due to it being almost as a standard, even true consumers actually buy and and that is potentially more than what would have been brought as without piracy, the software wouldn't have got free marketing.
(4) As because of widespread use, of the software it becomes de-facto and no body even tries to use legal and open source software, and dismiss those software just because a $1000 software can do what it can't do (a software which YOU CAN get for free)
(5) Thus because of widespread use the software gets even more sales, and they actually derive all the benefit because YOU CAN.

I always wonder how much market share MS Office would have in India in case it couldn't have been possibly pirated. I bet in single digit figures.

[celldweller1591]

I always wonder how much market share MS Office would have in India in case it couldn't have been possibly pirated. I bet in single digit figures.

May be less coz 150$ for an office suite(home edition), well that is not acc. to the appetite of ppl here.

[sujoyp]

Ook soo u people really think piracy is not sharing...I told this coz we share songs, movies, softwares, ebooks, and what not...all the digital content comes under this.
Using copied PS2 games also comes under it. And playing it is pushing piracy.

I guss if u even share a song using bluetooth u r increasing piracy.


If u share notes given by ur tution sir to someone who has not paid for that....its also piracy

U just cant say that u can stop piracy by using freeware...piracy is everywhere.

[rhitwick]

Any copyrighted thing u share in exchange of money with out the consent of the creator is piracy.

Its not a piracy until and unless money is involved, or neither of you actually gained profit money wise in the whole process.

[Liverpool_fan]

Originally Posted by sujoyp

Ook soo u people really think piracy is not sharing...I told this coz we share songs, movies, softwares, ebooks, and what not...all the digital content comes under this.
Using copied PS2 games also comes under it. And playing it is pushing piracy.

Yup it is piracy. Note I always say Piracy is NOT stealing.

I guss if u even share a song using bluetooth u r increasing piracy.

Depends on the license of the song.

If u share notes given by ur tution sir to someone who has not paid for that....its also piracy

Depends on the notes, if it is not copyrighted or Creative Commons license, it's not piracy. However photocopying from book to distribute among friends will be technically called piracy.

See I have no problem with Piracy as phenomenon with books, songs and movies. The only problem I have with Software as people unknowingly help those corporate giants by pirating by giving free marketing. This stalls growth of FOSS. In another case I have problem with games being pirated since I feel people should really buy the games they like after trying the demos. (I don't mind movies and music piracy because I despise DRM and hate those giant movie and music labels. Not pirating doesn't help the artistes in themselves either)
I know my stance is somewhat hypocritical but that's he way I feel.

U just cant say that u can stop piracy by using freeware...piracy is everywhere.

Freeware and Open Source provide plenty of great alternatives which you should use. Why do something illegal when you can do the same legally?
I don't have a single pirated software in my PC. Use Linux as my primary OS and got Windows Server 2008 for free via Microsoft Deamspark (which I use only for games). And I play free or original games only. I do pirate movies and music though.

[sujoyp]

Originally Posted by rhitwick

Any copyrighted thing u share in exchange of money with out the consent of the creator is piracy.

Its not a piracy until and unless money is involved, or neither of you actually gained profit money wise in the whole process.

OK soo u mean if I download a movie using torrent and distribute it among 100 friends its not piracy...LOL
Bro its piracy coz the movie lost its chance to gain money from those 100 people in form of tickets or dvd/vcd...soo money is involved!!

Note I always say Piracy is NOT stealing.

hey then if its not stealing it can be quoted as sharing..LOL

Depends on the license of the song.

what do u mean by this??...no song is free to distribute...u r cutting their profits by distributing...same as software

I am just saying that we all do some sort of piracy knowingly or un-knowingly...and its just impossible to control
Y should I pay Rs.200 for a song cd when I can get 10 movie songs for Rs.20...as simple as this

[Liverpool_fan]

Originally Posted by sujoyp

OK soo u mean if I download a movie using torrent and distribute it among 100 friends its not piracy...LOL
Bro its piracy coz the movie lost its chance to gain money from those 100 people in form of tickets or dvd/vcd...soo money is involved!!

It is piracy but money is not lost since I can bet none of those 100 people would buy a DVD and those who go to theatres go there anyway.

hey then if its not stealing it can be quoted as sharing..LOL

Sharing which involves breaking laws

what do u mean by this??...no song is free to distribute...u r cutting their profits by distributing...same as software

http://magnatune.com/
http://www.jamendo.com/en/

I am just saying that we all do some sort of piracy knowingly or un-knowingly...and its just impossible to control

That's true to some extent. But we should avoid piracy wherever we can. Not have "hahaha I will pirraatee it, im so cool" attitude.

[Aberforth]

Originally Posted by Liverpool_fan

I dont use the term stealing with piracy tbh. Stealing is when you take something from somebody. However piracy is more like breaking an agreement or something.

Exactly. Digital piracy is simply a breach of an agreement. One has to be really brainwashed to think it is stealing, in the real sense, no one actually gets robbed.
 
To curb piracy in India, corporates will need police and court system as a backbone, which is esentially hogging up an already overtaxed system, which could have been used for fighting REAL crimes.

[sujoyp]

I always read in magazines and newspaper that movie and music company r loosing billions due to piracy...

lets take an example .....I make a movie and sell it to u for 400 and u make 50 copies of it and sell it for total 1000(Rs.20 )each...shouldn't I feel robbed.

Actually the cost of digital product like music cd and movie dvd is soo high that its not worth spending that much on them.

My bro in US said that u can watch movie at home for 1-2 dollar only...if they charge Rs.20 for a movie then we too can watch them without making pirated dvds.

[Rahim]

Big Media Houses and Corporates involved are reporting massive profits every year and movies are being declared blockbusters and grossing $$$$ and what not and they cry that their products/movies are being pirated!!!!!!!! They must have gone bankrupt or worked as staff in my office

Software piracy helps these big corporate houses and if they are serious about stopping piracy, who are stopping them? Cant they make thei software un-crackable?

Windows piracy is quite high in the Asian countries (almost 90%) which means 90% less revenue for MS and despite that Bill Gates was the richest man for so long.
Just imagine if each and every computer had a legal version of Windows. what influence he might have had in this world. Competition is very essential for quality products and prevent exploitation.

@LFC: No point having that smug by declaring you dont use any pirated softwares and then mentioning about the movies andsic piracy done by yourself . Most of us are in this category.
I find it a little meaningless to buy the whole audio cd when it has only 1 good song.

[hellknight]

There is a very big reason why piracy is high in Asian countries.. The Per Capita Income in Asia (except Japan) is low.. whereas in the West it is high.. If you've ever bought a computer book like Fedora Bible, Beginning Linux programming etc etc either from Wrox India or Wiley's India, it is clearly mentioned that those books are meant for Eastern Economy edition, and are not to be sold outside specified areas. For eg, I got this brand new Fedora Linux Bible 2010 for Rs. 530 (from Flipkart) whereas the price in the US is around Rs. 3000 (mentioned on the book)

The software publishers need to apply the same theory to the software. I don't think that 90% of computer users in India can pay as high as Rs. 70k for Photoshop.. that is ridiculous..

[gagan007]

Originally Posted by hellknight

The software publishers need to apply the same theory to the software. I don't think that 90% of computer users in India can pay as high as Rs. 70k for Photoshop.. that is ridiculous..

completely agree, this could be a solution....

Originally Posted by a_rahim

Big Media Houses and Corporates involved are reporting massive profits every year and movies are being declared blockbusters and grossing $$$$ and what not and they cry that their products/movies are being pirated!!!!!!!! They must have gone bankrupt or worked as staff in my office

Software piracy helps these big corporate houses and if they are serious about stopping piracy, who are stopping them? Cant they make thei software un-crackable?

Windows piracy is quite high in the Asian countries (almost 90%) which means 90% less revenue for MS and despite that Bill Gates was the richest man for so long.
Just imagine if each and every computer had a legal version of Windows. what influence he might have had in this world. Competition is very essential for quality products and prevent exploitation.

I am aghast and sorry to hear that intellects like you are "justifying" piracy!!! No one forces you to use Windows (by you I do not mean "you" but all those using pirated versions of s/w, in general)...you can always use Linux...you are accusing Bill Gates as if he is holding the supply of your oxygen and charging every ounce of it....

what if production houses are earning $$$$...it is still their product, their creation, which they have full right of...just because they are earning a lot doesn't mean you can watch their movie without paying them.

@sujoyp: In India too, thanks to Moser Baer, we have access to all original movies accessible at dirt cheap rates legally

[Gauravs90]

Originally Posted by gagan007

In India too, thanks to Moser Baer, we have access to all original movies accessible at dirt cheap rates legally

They only sell old movies. Why i will buy an old movie which i've seen it in tv many times.

Originally Posted by sujoyp

My bro in US said that u can watch movie at home for 1-2 dollar only...if they charge Rs.20 for a movie then we too can watch them without making pirated dvds.

Isn't rs 20 too low for original movie. They should sell movie CD's for rs50 and DVD for rs75. Then anyone from middle class will think to buy.

[Rahim]

Originally Posted by gagan007

completely agree, this could be a solution....



I am aghast and sorry to hear that intellects like you are "justifying" piracy!!! No one forces you to use Windows (by you I do not mean "you" but all those using pirated versions of s/w, in general)...you can always use Linux...you are accusing Bill Gates as if he is holding the supply of your oxygen and charging every ounce of it....

what if production houses are earning $$$$...it is still their product, their creation, which they have full right of...just because they are earning a lot doesn't mean you can watch their movie without paying them.

@sujoyp: In India too, thanks to Moser Baer, we have access to all original movies accessible at dirt cheap rates legally

^Did I? I'm sure you agree with the non-competitive activities of a certain company.
Windows didn't got the market share just because their product was good; it did because users didn't had any choice.
Just tell me how many outside the geek world have even heard of something like a non-windows OS? Most of them think that the small "e" icon on their Quick Launch bar is THE INTERNET.
Users should be given a choice; example of EU giving an option to users to install non-IE browsers and in 60% case do install FF/Opera etc. I think thats a high % of users opting to try new thing.

As for the $$ they earn and me feeling jealous according to you; take the example of US. Land of opportunities and law and order and patent crap and YET piracy is rampant in that region. Why? Per Capita income if very high and YET users dont wanna pay for the software.

All I am trying to highlight the hypocrisi]y of the companies and us both.

@hellknight: I agree to your business model completely; differential pricing of the software is a must for different region.

Ultimate consumer is the king and i dont know why this cant be applied to the software world..

The biggest hindrance of adopting FOSS is the resistance to change by us; a natural reaction.

[sujoyp]

Isn't rs 20 too low for original movie. They should sell movie CD's for rs50 and DVD for rs75. Then anyone from middle class will think to buy.

OOh I forgot to mention that I was talking about DTH system...just like Tata Sky started...u pay them Rs.75 and u can watch movie at home...but choice here is too less..5-10 movie max
In US u could select from a big list and watch it at home by DTH at a cost of around 2 Dollar...and HD have different rate...it can easily tackle movie piracy if given cheap like RS.20-30 in India

[Rahim]

^Wait before this DTH service providers milk the cow nicely before shifting focus to other services. Time is not right at the moment