MUP - MS OS for 3$ (beat tht open source)

[anandk]

A $3 Software package as a part of the program.

Microsoft Corp. said Thursday it will build on existing efforts to bridge the digital divide worldwide and announced several new ventures, including a $3 software package for governments that subsidize student computers.

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/070419/microsoft_unlimited_potential.html?.v=4

The software maker said it will sell a Student Innovation Suite, which includes Windows XP Starter Edition and Microsoft Office Home and Student 2007, for $3 to governments that subsidize a certain percentage of the cost of PCs for primary and secondary students for use at home and at school, starting in the second half of the year.

So What is Microsoft Unlimited Potential?
http://www.microsoft.com/emerging/Images/aboutunlimitedpotential/logo-up.gif
"It's about helping individuals and communities around the globe achieve their goals and dreams through relevant, accessible, and affordable technologies. Our mission—to enable new avenues of social and economic opportunity extends particularly to the estimated 5 billion people that have yet to realize the benefits of technology. With our partners, both public and private, we focus on transforming education, fostering local innovation, and enabling jobs and opportunities to create a continuous cycle of sustained social and economic growth for everyone..."

more about the program here at http://www.microsoft.com/emerging/AboutUnlimitedPotential/UnlimitedPotential.mspx

[freebird]

The reality bite read below:
Microsoft's $3 anti-Linux weapon
In Beijing, Bill Gates announced this week that Microsoft's "Unlimited Potential" initiative will now include offering a software package, the Student Innovation Suite (http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,2115695,00.asp), to governments and students in emerging countries across the world at a price of just $3.

This suite, available in the second half of 2007, will include Windows XP Starter Edition (http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1616623,00.asp); Microsoft Office Home and Student 2007, Microsoft Math 3.0, Learning Essentials 2.0 for Microsoft Office, and Windows Live Mail desktop. However, Microsoft has no takers for its offering yet.

Officially, the goal is to help bring social and economic opportunity through new products and programs to as many as possible of the potential 5 billion people who do not yet use Microsoft products.

What a lot of bull feces. The goal is to kill open source off at its roots. Microsoft wants to make sure that young people in developing countries get brainwashed into the Microsoft way of computing.

Here's what's really happening. Microsoft is seeing that the OLPC (One Laptop Per Child) initiative is taking off (http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS6090685837.html). Soon, millions of kids will be using a computer for the first time, and their first computer is going to be running Sugar (http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Sugar), an innovative software environment built on top of a Red Hat Fedora-based Linux variant.

Microsoft is also seeing how Linux distributions are moving quickly ahead of Windows in Africa, where Ubuntu is gaining popularity; South America, where Mandriva is making inroads; and China, which has its own powerful ecosystem of Linux companies such as Red Flag (http://www.redflag-linux.com/eindex.html) and Sun Wah Linux (http://www.sw-linux.com/en/scripts/main/index.php).

As Ubuntu founding father Mark Shuttleworth recently told me: "We're seeing Ubuntu being picked up in Asia, Russia, Ukraine, and South America. So, those places have become a real focus for us." And, in particular, "Desktop Linux is very attractive in emerging counties."

Why? That's simple: Linux is inexpensive and it works. Unlike North America and, to some extent, Western Europe, the rest of the world isn't addicted to Microsoft's offerings. They can see with far clearer eyes than most Americans that Windows is not the be-all and end-all of operating systems.

Another factor is that in many countries, there's a real desire to not get tied up with Microsoft. After all, why help Bill Gates in the U.S. become ever richer, when you can help software developers in your own country create your own local version of Silicon Valley based on Linux and open source? You can see that in France, where the National Assembly recently moved to Linux desktops (http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS6755477184.html), and in South Korea, which wants to help its native software businesses (http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS2153719907.html).

For the first time since burying OS/2, Microsoft is all too aware that it has competition for the American desktop. Apple has emerged as a serious competitor once more, and I think the Linux desktop is really starting to worry (http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS2930812631.html) the folks from Redmond.

Consider this: On April 18, Michael Dell, head of Dell Computers (http://www.dell.com/), the No. 2 PC vendor in the world (http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,2115484,00.asp) with a market share of 15.2 percent, told the world that he's using Ubuntu Linux on his home laptop (http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,2115484,00.asp). Dell Inc. has also announced that it will soon be selling PCs and laptops with preloaded Linux (http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS8436091466.html).

Oh, and the number-1 PC company in the world, HP? It hasn't come out and said it, but rumor has it that it's readying consumer pre-loads of Linux on the desktop as well.

There was a time when hardware vendors announcing that they were going to sell and support any operating system except Windows would have been unthinkable. Microsoft would destroy them (http://practical-tech.com/business/who-is-microsofts-secret-power-broker).

What? You thought Microsoft became number-1 because it had better products? Please!

Read, if you will, part of a 2006 complaint (http://www.channelinsider.com/article/Tangent+Suit+Claims+Microsoft+Soaked+Partners/171923_1.aspx) by Tangent, a Burlingame, Calif.-based OEM (original equipment manufacturer), about Microsoft's business practices: "Because Microsoft, through its exclusionary practices, eliminated its competitors from the market and has blocked entry of new competitors and expansion of existing rivals, it has been able to increase, maintain or stabilize prices at anticompetitive levels" since the late 1980s.

"Microsoft's supra-competitive prices are not the result of superior products or competition on the merits. Rather, Microsoft has been able, at the financial expense of purchasers to artificially inflate its profits...," the complaint added.

Amen, brother!

The people who run Microsoft aren't idiots. They see that they're losing any chance they might have of seizing the global PC market. They know that their iron grip on the North American and Western European markets is starting to rust.

So, by throwing almost free products on the world market, they're trying to ruin the chances of Linux and open source. If Linux continues to make gains in the U.S. and Canada, I expect that Microsoft may even -- oh, how it'll hate this -- cut the prices on Vista and Office.

I don't think, however, that Microsoft will get away with it. Dumping product is a no-no in any country's trade plans. Besides, a home-grown version of Linux, OpenOffice, and Thunderbird is still cheaper than Microsoft's $3 suite. People who don't live in places where Microsoft rules have also realized that, while the first taste of Microsoft products may be free, the long-term costs are enormous.

Last, but far from least, people everywhere are finally realizing that they don't need to buy into Microsoft's expensive monopoly to use their PCs. It's really quite simple: You don't need Windows anymore, and Microsoft is continuing to con you, and the rest of the world, into believing that you do.

source:
http://www.linux-watch.com/news/NS6409071283.html

[anandk]

:D looks like the news has ruffled a lot of feathers ! well thats microsofts story : damned if they do something; damned if they dont :D thanx for presenting the other side too.

and oh, b4 i forget- make no mistake- Microsoft is not promoting its efforts as charity. "This is a business, not a philanthropic effort," said Microsoft senior vice president Orlando Ayala. MS is planning to double its user base from the present billion, by 2015 !

[faraaz]

If only I could learn Linux...I'd shift in a trice!! I tried installing Ubuntu but its just too hard...why re-invent the wheel when I can use Win XP instead?? Maybe if DX-10 becomes available on Linux and software like Cedega is available to play my games on Linux..I'll shift from XP instead of buying Vista...

[eddie]

@anandk: The problem is that rarely (or never?) do Microsoft work in a transparent manner. Even with the current move, it is clear that Microsoft feels threatened by its losing grip on developing countries' computer markets. Do you see any valid reason behind Microsoft selling Windows XP Starter Edition at or above 30 US Dollars but comes out with a new package with bundled goodies for 3 US Dollars? Price reduction by 10 times or more? I smell fear!!! Microsoft just doesn't want the developing countries to accept Linux. I wonder how soon Microsoft will come out with "Highly Unlimited Potential Programme" and will start giving out Windows copies for free.

In any case, someone tell me why one should use Windows XP Starter Edition (or Unlimited Potential for that matter) rather than Ubuntu 7.04 and I am all ears.

[gx_saurav]

In any case, someone tell me why one should use Windows XP Starter Edition (or Unlimited Potential for that matter) rather than Ubuntu 7.04 and I am all ears.

Because most of the required apps in school work in Windows without a geek interface.

& Why would you care if MS works in transparent manner. If they don't work properly it is there problem & there loss. Why are you justifying it.

[freebird]

^ bcoz M$ is trying to kill Open Source;the known thing.
there are lot of school distros of Linux available;schools in kerela state already shifted(1 year now) to it@school distro based on Debian.also are distros like edubuntu,a derivative custom made for Students.there are 1000's of software available for Students.DO visit
http://www.schoolforge.net/ before spreading FUD(copyrighted by microwsoft) here.

If only I could learn Linux...I'd shift in a trice!! I tried installing Ubuntu but its just too hard...why re-invent the wheel when I can use Win XP instead?? Maybe if DX-10 becomes available on Linux and software like Cedega is available to play my games on Linux..I'll shift from XP instead of buying Vista... Linux is easy.U should stand with this Free software projcts to cut down the harms due to M$ monopoly. U can ask ur doubts in Open Source Section,nothing hard.DX10 is just for M$.ofcourse cedega is a paid software although Wine (http://www.thinkdigit.com/forum/www.winehq.com/) is supporting more and more windows games in Linux.U can read ubuntuguide reg doubts.
http://whylinuxisbetter.net
http://ubuntuguide.org/
what is Free Open Source Software(FOSS)
http://fsf.org

[Zeeshan Quireshi]

^ bcoz M$ is trying to kill Open Source;the known thing.


..... , dunno what to say , ppl r such jerks .

even though if they started using an OS soft only a week ago they'll go on about how good it is n , bla bla bla .

i'm not sayin that OS is bad , but i'm sayin that MS is not bad too , got it .

it's da users choice to use what he wants , u need not blame MS .

[iMav]

Microsoft Offering Software to Developing Countries For Only $3.00 (http://www.dailytech.com/Article.aspx?newsid=6981)

Student Innovation Suite contains XP Starter Edition, Office Home, and educational software

Microsoft has unveiled an interesting alternative to the OLPC as a solution to developing countries. Rather than providing a new platform and requiring an order of one million units, Microsoft's plan is to offer very low pricing on their popular Windows and Office products -- in fact, the projected price is only three dollars. (http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=5248)

Microsoft's program to reach developing countries is known as "Unlimited Potential" and is aiming to double the computing base by 2015 by reaching out to a billion people with low-cost software. In order to qualify for the discounted price, governments will need to provide free PCs for school use.

AMD has a similar program in place called 50x15 that is centered on its Personal Internet Communicator, but Microsoft is not offering its own hardware. Instead, it is expected that Microsoft will leverage the upcoming Intel Classmate PC (http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=5248), which has already stated to run Windows XP.

The $3.00 package includes Windows XP Starter Edition (http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/newsroom/winxp/WinXPStarterFS.mspx), Microsoft Office 2007 Home and Student Edition, and several other unnamed educational programs. XP Starter Edition differs from the other versions of XP by its rather significant limitations (http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyID=1f3b9e44-3963-4b6c-851b-1e275f4947e7&DisplayLang=en) - 800x600 maximum resolution, a maximum of three programs open at once, and "client-only" networking are some of the major caps placed on the cheaper version.

Despite the parallels drawn to the OLPC project, Microsoft isn't trying to pull the wool over anyone's eyes. "This is not a philanthropic effort, this is a business," stated Orlando Ayala of Microsoft. In many developing countries, pirated software is sold for pennies on the dollar; but Microsoft seems confident that the program will find favor with governments seeking to promote education programs in their countries.

http://images.dailytech.com/nimage/4505_large_xpstarter.jpg

http://images.dailytech.com/nimage/4506_large_classmate.jpg

http://images.dailytech.com/nimage/4507_large_amd-pic-big.jpg

3 Cheers for Billy G

Source (http://www.dailytech.com/Microsoft+Offering+Software+to+Developing+Countrie s+For+Only+300/article6981.htm)

[shantanu]

me too !!! cheers^3 .. :D:D:D:D great news (i was just preparing this article)

ADDED: to have this offer.. you only have to go with a PHoTOCOPY of your RASHAN CARD... thats all.. i think it will be launched very soon and the price expected is Rs.162/-

[mehulved]

Can you explain - beat that open source? What is MS offering here that open source isn't?

[kalpik]

Nothing beats "free", does it? And its free without stupid restrictions like a max resolution of "800x600" :|

[rakeshishere]

OLD news! already heard from anandk :)..Already Posted HERE (http://www.thinkdigit.com/forum/showthread.php?t=55614)

Thread Reported

[apoorv.sharma]

"aapka hardware...mouse ka upyog karna" !!!..LOLZZZZZZZZ...

[freebird]

So there are ppl who are against Open SOurce and Free Software.hmm..

[Pathik]

merge the two threads tyf..

[gx_saurav]

Cool Rs 162 for Office 2007 student edition. i m jumping to it. Might help some of the students here who don't need outlook.

[prateek_san]

cool news ......ye ye MS..... :D

[rakeshishere]

M$ is not open source and open source is not M$...Plz don't compare them:x

[mehulved]

It costs more than OLPC and you say beat that? What's there to beat?
OLPC's OS has resolution of 1024x768, it can run more than 3 softwares at a time, yes we tried that. X server was forwarded via ssh and firefox and gnome-calculator were run. So, that means it has more than basic networking that XP SE has.
And the best of all, OLCP in it's current version just cost $150 whereas this will cost $3 for the software + $400 for the hardware. Almost 2.68 times the cost. Beat that!

[eddie]

Because most of the required apps in school work in Windows without a geek interface.Define "geek interface".
& Why would you care if MS works in transparent manner. If they don't work properly it is there problem & there loss. Why are you justifying it. Did you even read the post I was replying to? I was replying to anandk's post regarding "damn if they do...damn if they don't" and not "justifying" anything.

[shantanu]

what do you mean $400 for the hardware,, m$ is not saying you to buy that PC, its just selling the software so that developing countries can use genuine..

and i think you guys must have read that """FREE """" isnt means that it doesnt cost anything.. Free means that if i buy linux OSS then i can distribute it free...

i read somewhere that it is thought that FREE in linux is meant free of cost... its not that... even LINUX versions..

RHEL costs : from $80-339 ,

and i think an OSS also needs a computer to run.. or you run it VIRTUALLY..

[freebird]

..... , dunno what to say , ppl r such jerks .

even though if they started using an OS soft only a week ago they'll go on about how good it is n , bla bla bla .

i'm not sayin that OS is bad , but i'm sayin that MS is not bad too , got it .

it's da users choice to use what he wants , u need not blame MS .
I am using GNU/Linux for the past 4 years.do understand ppl lives in this world without the monopoly OS.there are ppl who runs GNU/Linux on vmware etc and not all tasting the power of the beast and thinking they are the Wise Geeks who saves earth.
Windows is just a s/w, am pointing about the monopoly company using patent warfare,FUD (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear%2C_uncertainty_and_doubt),SCOing (http://blogs.redhat.com/executive/archives/000273.html)on alternate OS which are growing fast.

[praka123]

Let the users decide the virtues of Linux or Free Software U cant force someone!.but i too dont understand where does M$ beat opensource with this deal.:confused:

[mehulved]

what do you mean $400 for the hardware,, m$ is not saying you to buy that PC, its just selling the software so that developing countries can use genuine..
Yeah and offering you crippleware. Linux offers the software for free without any such restrictions.

and i think you guys must have read that """FREE """" isnt means that it doesnt cost anything.. Free means that if i buy linux OSS then i can distribute it free...Yeah free has always been for freedom and not for for free of cost, but that's with open source not with FSF. Anyways that's another point.

i read somewhere that it is thought that FREE in linux is meant free of cost... its not that... even LINUX versions..

RHEL costs : from $80-339 ,
Those charges are for services not for the product. Doesn't MS charge insanely high for servers compared to desktops? Service charges are always there, if you give service free of cost then you're insane.

and i think an OSS also needs a computer to run.. or you run it VIRTUALLY.. Well that was for mav3 who put up the AMD PIC and wrote - beat this open source, and started comparing with OLPC. The starter edition MS is trying to offer to school kids as compitition to OLPC, has Intel's classmate PC (http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=5248) and it costs $400. So, effectively you pay $403. Now I don't know in which universe $403>$100. Maybe MS whitewashes you fanboys to believe that.

Because most of the required apps in school work in Windows without a geek interface.
Have a look at sugar interface used in OLPC.

[shantanu]

Those charges are for services not for the product. Doesn't MS charge insanely high for servers compared to desktops? Service charges are always there, if you give service free of cost then you're insane.

in that matter the charges for Servers are more than $3000 for redhat..

i wrote the price of Desktop edition :p

Maybe MS whitewashes you fanboys to believe that.

can you be more clear on white wash
if you are saying me a fanboy, then surely you are also one for linux... isnt it..

and i dont know what exactly do you rate to call a person a FANBOY... i just take the right one :p

PS: nothing personal.. just topic flame :D

[mehulved]

in that matter the charges for Servers are more than $3000 for redhat..

i wrote the price of Desktop edition :p
I don't know anyone using Red Hat on desktop and why would they? Well it's just fedora + official support. I think you need to go back and check again. Only paid desktop distros I remember of are - linspire and xandros. Again, they're paid cos they contain all proprietory codecs. As for lispire it is one of the most shunned distros by the community for being MS'ish. No one from linux community even gave a damn to it when MS sued them for the name lindows.

[shantanu]

and i dont think MS cares if anyone gives a DAMN or not :D:D

and well i checked it.. desktop and servers subscriptions are same as i posted... they are paid...

www.redhat.com/rhel

[mehulved]

and i dont think MS cares if anyone gives a DAMN or not :D:DWhy would they give a damn to 5% when they can loot 90%

and well i checked it.. desktop and servers subscriptions are same as i posted... they are paid...

www.redhat.com/rhel But, why would someone in their right mind buy it. And as it is the version used for OLPC is not paid. And this thread doesn't focus on servers and services.

[shantanu]

ya sure this thread does not focus on that...

but you can't say the words loot of 90%...
Give a proof of this..

[..:: Free Radical ::..]

I look forward to the individual specs of the 50x15, Intel Classmate PC & the OLPC.
Looks like a handy device to carry around and do justice to all my ebooks.
So can any1 post their specifications, processor speed, RAM, Hard disk space etc. instead of the Billy vs. OSS discussion. I hope the OS is not hardcoded into flash memory like in mobile phones/handheld devices and generic common drivers, I want to have freedom over choice of OS. :D. I am looking for a bargain UMPC :))

EDIT: From DesktopLinux.com

http://www.desktoplinux.com/files/misc/olpc-green-white-thm.jpgThe One Laptop Per Child program reported today that after 303 builds, it finally has a satisfactory version of its Red Hat Linux-based Sugar operating system that is considered stable, according to OLPC president for software and content Walter Bender.

"After a final few bugs that had hidden in corners were driven into the light, we issued Stable Build 303 along with Q2B76 firmware this week," Bender said in his weekly email report.

Highlights of this stable build, according to Bender, include:

A working mesh network
An updated Web browser that scales on the high-resolution screen, making for an improved web experience
Gnash, the FOSS Flash player (still somewhat unstable), is pre-installed; Adobe's Flash 9 is also known to work but is not packaged or installed as part of the build
A touch-pad driver fix for jumping cursor: The touch pad should be more usable, and the tablet is enabled on B2 systems
Boot time has improved due to a scheduler fixThe Cambridge, Mass.-based project says it shipped about 2,500 test laptops (http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS4707471745.html)to eight nations last month. Earlier this month, OLPC shipped 100 machines to children in a Nigerian test school, Bender said.

The experiment was a prelude to mass production of the kid-friendly, lime-green and white laptops scheduled to begin in July, when 5 million are scheduled to be built, according to Taiwanese laptop maker Quanta.

State educators in Brazil, Uruguay, Libya, Rwanda, Pakistan, Thailand, and possibly Ethiopia and the West Bank received the first of the machines in February's pilot prior to a wider rollout to Indonesia and a handful of other countries, according to the project.

Background on the project

OLPC aims to distribute -- free of charge -- millions of low-cost, self-powered, low-cost Linux laptops (http://www.desktoplinux.com/articles/AT5734583728.html) to needy children around the world, with governments making the purchases. The original cost target for the OLPC laptops was $100 (₨ 4,200), but that number has drifted upward slightly, over the past year or so, to about $150 (₨ 6,280).

The idea behind the OLPC laptop is to provide children with the opportunity to learn about learning itself -- to explore, experiment and express themselves, an OLPC spokesperson said. The laptops will be distributed in schools.

Key features of the OLPC laptop include a 7.5-inch 1200 x 900 pixel LCD screen, a keyboard that switches between languages, a digital video camera, built-in 802.11b/g wireless connectivity, a hand crank to charge its built-in rechargeable battery, and a customized version of Fedora Core Linux tailored for remote regions.

The device is based on a low-power, x86-compatible AMD Geode "embedded" processor clocked at 366MHz. It has 128MB of DRAM, along with 512MB of nonvolatile flash memory for program and data storage, and is equipped with three USB 2.0 ports for expansion. It boots via LinuxBIOS into Linux.

The OLPC project, based at the MIT media lab in Cambridge, is well into its second year. OLPC founding include AMD, News Corp, Google, Brightstar, Red Hat Linux, Nortel, Marvell, eBay, Quanta, Chi Mei, SES/Astra, and Citigroup. The United Nations and Inter-American Development Bank are its non-profit partners.

More about the OLPC Project
For lots of background on the OLPC's Linux-based low-cost laptop project -- including features, specs, and a timeline of announcements -- be sure to peruse our comprehensive OLPC special report:


Key Features and Specs
The OLPC lists the following key features and specs for the proposed low-cost laptops on its website:

Processor -- AMD Geode GX2-500@1.0W clocked at 366MHz
Memory -- 128MB of DRAM
Storage -- no hard drive; instead, the unit will have 512MB of internal nonvolatile "flash memory," used for programs and data storage
Display -- 7.5-inch "dual-mode" 1200 x 900 pixel display
Mono display: High-resolution, reflective monochrome mode
Color display: Standard-resolution, quincunx-sampled, transmissive color mode
Expansion -- three USB 2.0 ports; SD card slot
Wireless networking -- built-in 802.11b/g WiFi
Power supply -- built-in rechargeable battery back with wind-up charger
System software:
OS -- a version of Fedora Core Linux is available for testing, but Fedora is not necessarily the shipped OS
User interface -- Sugar, "a custom built interface designed for the kids"
Boot environment -- LinuxBIOSEDIT2 : Ooopsie. Just noted the post below

[mehulved]

Here you go for OLPC - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Hardware_specification
Intel Classmate - http://download.intel.com/intel/worldahead/pdf/classmatepc_productbrief.pdf?iid=worldahead+ed_cmp c_pdf

But, will they be available to general public? I am not so sure.

[Third Eye]

Cool news :D

[anandk]

Can you explain - beat that open source? What is MS offering here that open source isn't?

its not my title. i had titled the thread simply as : Microsoft® Unlimited Potential Programme.

praps some mod changed it to : MS OS for 3$ (beat tht open source):rolleyes:

i think a title :

Microsoft® Unlimited Potential Programme - S/W's for $3

wud then be better !

[Choto Cheeta]

@tech_your_future

regarding those Cheap budget Lappy or PCs,

I just saw a demo of New Acer Product !! Its about to come to the market within 15/20 days... only they are waiting to see USd 3 factor or they would bundle XP Home...

Celeron M 900 MHz
256MB DDR
2GB HDD
2 USD 2.0 (Usb booting supported)
7" Screen running 800x600 :)
LAN Port
Wifi Ready

Expected Price Rs. 13200/- without OS !! Expected Market Price (Take home) under 15k :D

Acer gave us a demo regarding this.. !! :)

P.S. Dont count me as an offcial annoucer :p... Wait for them to annouce :)

[iMav]

its not my title. i had titled the thread simply as : Microsoft® Unlimited Potential Programme.

praps some mod changed it to : MS OS for 3$ (beat tht open source):rolleyes:

i think a title :

Microsoft® Unlimited Potential Programme - S/W's for $3

wud then be better ! t_y_f took my title and ur first pos ... smart guy ....:)

[Pathik]

^^ 8ur title is where the fight started... it wd have been confusing if anand's title wd hav been maintained...

[mehulved]

t_y_f took my title and ur first pos ... smart guy ....:) Simply, I merged THIS thread with anandk's thread, so the thread title of this thread prevailed. But, the posts are always arranged in the chronological order so anandk's post came first.

[Zeeshan Quireshi]

lolz , when i saw title "MUP - MS OS for 3$(Beat that Open Source)"

i thought it was written "MUP - Mac OS for 3$(Beat that Open Source)"

[eddie]

in that matter the charges for Servers are more than $3000 for redhat.. That price you quote for RHEL is of RHEL application stack which comes with LAMP stack installed and supported. Microsoft's alternative to MySQL i.e. SQL Server alone costs $25,000 for single processor.

Just some perspective of the costs...

[gx_saurav]

Isn't OLPC limiting the kids with only 512 MB Harddisk? Stop comparing XP starter edition with linux. They are made for different segments. XP starter edtion is a boon for those companies & schools which usually run 1 or 2 apps only at one time for educational purpose or official purpose. Has anyone of U ever seen how work is done in call centers, garment shops, big bazaar or Mcdy? They all run one or 2 apps only together at once, whole day.

[thunderbird.117]

Because most of the required apps in school work in Windows without a geek interface.


Geek Interface. :confused: What do you mean by that?.

[gx_saurav]

XP starter edition does sux for home usage. But who buys XP SE for home usage? just keep in mind for which segment of market it is made for. It would be a better idea to use XP starter edition everywhere where only one or two apps run whole day & only if your software is made for Windows. Linux has advantage if it is like an embeded systam like Panasonic made Mcdonalds bill machine. & Plz MS for gods sake up the resolution to 1024 X 768

[thunderbird.117]

XP starter edition does sux for home usage. But who buys XP SE for home usage? just keep in mind for which segment of market it is made for. It would be a better idea to use XP starter edition everywhere where only one or two apps run whole day & only if your software is made for Windows. Linux has advantage if it is like an embeded systam like Panasonic made Mcdonalds bill machine. & Plz MS for gods sake up the resolution to 1024 X 768

Starter Editon sucks. They are so many limation in that editon. Who do they think they are fooling?. Does MS think bring starter will reduce the piracy?.

[gx_saurav]

yo i m online by phone, so missed your post. mine should have auto merged.

geek interface = Command Line & bad offline package management. Although in case of such embeded machines UI is always custom made for there particular task.

starter edition has limitation for home usage, but not for embeded single app usage. MS should rethink on what to provide & what to skip in such low cost OS & change the name to XP One Node Edition :D

[Desi-Tek.com]

does MVP means free marketing? of Microsoft's valuable product?

btw i enjoy both windows and linux :)

[mehulved]

geek interface = Command Line & bad offline package management. Although in case of such embeded machines UI is always custom made for there particular task. Download http://olpc.download.redhat.com/olpc/streams/sdk/latest/livecd/ and see the interface. I don't think 350mb is too big.
And who says CLI means bad interface?

[freebird]

does MVP means free marketing? of Microsoft's valuable product?

btw i enjoy both windows and linux :) You pointed it Correctly.this is like you are paid for ur mouth shut against the Company..sadly We Linux,Mac users not yet have any MVPs:D:D

Linux Powered OLPC:http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Category:Laptop_pictures
http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/4091/800pxap138at6.th.jpg (http://img243.imageshack.us/my.php?image=800pxap138at6.jpg)

http://wiki.laptop.org/images/0/0a/Orange3.png

http://www.laptop.org/img/specs_dimensions.jpg
http://www.laptop.org/laptop/hardware/specs.shtml
specs

We are using components from Red Hat's Fedora Core 6 version of the Linux operating system; we are tracking the main kernel fairly closely.
We will support five programming environments on the laptop: (1) Python (http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Python/), from which we have built our user interface and our activity model; (2) Javascript (http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Javascript/) for browser-based scripting; (3) Csound (http://wiki.laptop.org/go/CSound), a programmable music and audio environment; (4) Squeak (http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Squeak), a version of Smalltalk embedded into a media-rich authoring environment; and (5) Logo (http://wiki.laptop.org/go/LOGO). We will also provide some support Java and Flash.
Applications will include a web browser built on Xulrunner (http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Xulrunner), the run-time environment used by the Firefox browser; a simple document viewer based upon Evince (http://www.gnome.org/projects/evince/); the AbiWord (http://wiki.laptop.org/go/AbiWord) wordprocessor, an RSS reader (http://penguintv.sourceforge.net/), an email client, chat client, VOIP client; a journal (http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Human_Interface_Guidelines#Journaling) a wiki with WYSIWYG editing; a multimedia authoring and playback environment; a music composition toolkit, graphics toolkits, games, a shell, and a debugger.
Libraries and plugins used by OLPC include Xul (http://www.mozilla.org/newlayout/), GTK+ (http://www.gtk.org/), Matchbox (http://projects.o-hand.com/matchbox), Sugar (http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Sugar), Pango (http://www.pango.org/), ATK (http://developer.gnome.org/projects/gap/), Cairo (http://cairographics.org/), X Window System (http://x.org/), Avahi (http://avahi.org/), and gstreamer (http://gstreamer.freedesktop.org/).

http://www.laptop.org/en/laptop/software/specs.shtml
http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Video_of_the_OLPC

[gx_saurav]

That UI comment was not for OLPC. I was talking about the comment that Linux should be used in goverment PCs, Here is the thing. If offices or companies are already using Windows enviroment so it makes sence to go to Windows XP Starter edition cos in case of Linux it means training. (which is complete bull***). Goverment should hire someone to make the Linux UI customisable for there particular task only. It is linux so this is possible. Hide all menus which are not required & show only that is required.

Personally, OLPC project is just a way for companies to make future buyers. Kids should be tought to read books & do calculation in mind insted of using Wikipedia & calculatar

[eddie]

geek interface = Command Line & bad offline package management. Is this your own definition or is it based on some IT convention?
If it is your personal opinion then imo Geek Interface = Weird error messages (illegal operation, BSODs?) and plethora of anti-*

Isn't OLPC limiting the kids with only 512 MB Harddisk? Mass storage: 1024 MiB SLC NAND flash, high-speed flash controller
It is 1GB in OLPC, which incidentally is equal to what Intel is offering in its Linux classmate PC.

[gx_saurav]

Again Just 1 GB. A normal PC has 20 40 60 GB of storage space. But then again considering OLPC's recharging ability by that handle & usage I like 1 GB is good enough

[mehulved]

It's a flash disk. And these devices aren't supposed to store much on them besides whatever comes inbuilt. These are just supposed to be used as learning devices. Storage can be done on a central server.
Putting a normal hard disk means having moving parts which makes these laptops less durable. They are supposed to be durable and shock resistant upto a point,but that doesn't mean you go banging it on the walls and expect it to work then.They are supposed to be used by kids, so very much likelyhood of it being dropped and lugged around.

[azzu]

when is it comin to india

the olpc

[mail2and]

Kids should be tought to read books & do calculation in mind insted of using Wikipedia & calculatar

Kids should also be taught to improve their vocabulary and grammar. Of course, depending upon calculators is not advisable. :)

Microsoft is fine with people pirating their OS. I mean they would rather have some kid using a pirated copy of their OS, rather than that kid using Linux.

Linux has a great future in places like Kerala, where kids are being taught how to operate computers on open source operating system. When these kids grow up, they will have a choice. A choice that many kids in developed countries do not have. Microsoft wants to kill this choice. It's obvious that their only objective is to capture maximum market share to create value for their shareholders.

It's not fair to compare Microsoft with the open source movement. Both have different objectives, and even more different means to achieve these objectives. You can't compare a shining example of American laissez-faire capitalism with a social movement.

[mehulved]

when is it comin to india

the olpc Depends on GoI. AFAIK, they won't be sold directly. The government of each country has to pre-order them in bulk so as to achieve the economies of scale thus reducing the price and getting it down to around $100 mark. Then the government can subsidise it and get it to the children.

[Zeeshan Quireshi]

That price you quote for RHEL is of RHEL application stack which comes with LAMP stack installed and supported. Microsoft's alternative to MySQL i.e. SQL Server alone costs $25,000 for single processor.

Just some perspective of the costs...

well if u're comparing that then u should know that SQL server has got Features such as stored procedures , reporting etc Since version 7(released in 1999) that MYSQL 5.1 has got just now(2006) , now current version of SQL Server 2005(v9.0) is FAR FAR better n advanced that MySQL .

also the price you r Quoting is For Enterprise Edition n that too on a per-processor basis , if you r counting features then let me remind you that the features present in Standard version of SQL Server 2005($5999) per processor r much more than Mysql Enterprise version($4995.00) also please note that MySQL enterprise edition does not inculde Server Clustering by default , which is Included in SQL Server , so you have to buy MySQL MaxDB for clustering whihch costs n additional $1490

So total Cost Of MySQL Enterprise edition , which is almost one-tenth of SQL Server 2005 in features comes out to be $4995 + $1490 = $6485 Whereas SQL Server 2005 Standard Edition Costs $5999 so now which is more Cost effective ?

[kumarmohit]

when is it comin to india

the olpc

OLPC is not coming to India because Mr Maran thinks its a toy and we need more classrooms and teachers and so India has backed out of project after initial participation.

As For the raging debate, People the offer will only be available to Governments who are going to give PCs to state funded institutions can have this scheme on them.

You will not able to avail this offer in Open market. Do you think MS would be that stupid. It did not become such a monstrosity by charity.

I personally think that now MS id concentrating more on selling Vista. WinXP Starter cud have been replaced with Win2000 Pro because of its lesser HW needs and near XP stabilty:)

[gx_saurav]

Kids should also be taught to improve their vocabulary and grammar. Of course, depending upon calculators is not advisable. :)

Yup, kids should be tought better hindi. Most of them know A B C D but not ka , kha ,ga, gha.

(need hindi fonts)

It's obvious that their only objective is to capture maximum market share to create value for their shareholders.

Isn't that what all companies do anyway?

By the way, nice comparision of MySQL zeeshan, didn't know the prices myself.

[freebird]

Kids should also be taught to improve their vocabulary and grammar. Of course, depending upon calculators is not advisable. :)

Microsoft is fine with people pirating their OS. I mean they would rather have some kid using a pirated copy of their OS, rather than that kid using Linux.

Linux has a great future in places like Kerala, where kids are being taught how to operate computers on open source operating system. When these kids grow up, they will have a choice. A choice that many kids in developed countries do not have. Microsoft wants to kill this choice. It's obvious that their only objective is to capture maximum market share to create value for their shareholders.

It's not fair to compare Microsoft with the open source movement. Both have different objectives, and even more different means to achieve these objectives. You can't compare a shining example of American laissez-faire capitalism with a social movement.
tend to Agree to most parts

[eddie]

also the price you r Quoting is For Enterprise Edition n that too on a per-processor basis , if you r counting features then let me remind you that the features present in Standard version of SQL Server 2005($5999) per processor r much more than Mysql Enterprise version($4995.00) also please note that MySQL enterprise edition does not inculde Server Clustering by default , which is Included in SQL Server , so you have to buy MySQL MaxDB for clustering whihch costs n additional $1490I can't really argue on the features part because I have a very limited knowledge about RDBMS. Also I could not find any specific comparisons about features included in MySQL and SQL Server 2005 Standard edition thus it limits my knowledge all the more but I would definitely like to call you on the price factor and the clustering in SQL Standard Edition.

The cost thing that I mentioned was regarding RHEL and not MySQL. Considering the fact that RHEL comes with LAMP application stack pre-installed and pre-supported, you will not be needing to buy support for MaxDB from MySQL. It will be provided by RHEL thus not increasing your costs. Also, the costs you mention for MySQL and MaxDB are not purchase costs. The software is free to download and use but the cost is for 1 year of "Premium Support" which includes "unlimited incidents" of 24x7 phone support. Considering the fact that SQL Server, 2005 support from Microsoft comes at $245 per incident in normal times (http://support.microsoft.com/oas/default.aspx?ln=en-us&x=14&y=11&prid=8588&gprid=312884) and $490-$590 in after hours (http://support.microsoft.com/gp/afterhours) makes you understand the price factor.

Now coming to clustering. According to Microsoft's own pages, SQL Standard edition supports clustering between just two nodes. Now, considering the fact that any company that would like to cluster their database would also be wanting to run a management server...the second supported node just gets taken without providing any actual benefits of clustering thus this whole feature looks rather feeble in standard edition. On the other hand, MaxDB does not have any such restrictions and the additional cost you pay is for support incidents.
So total Cost Of MySQL Enterprise edition , which is almost one-tenth of SQL Server 2005 in features comes out to be $4995 + $1490 = $6485 Whereas SQL Server 2005 Standard Edition Costs $5999 so now which is more Cost effective ? I have already explained about the costs. Please include the support costs in as well and then observe which is more cost effective. Considering 30 total incidents in a year out of which 10 could be in after hours, the support cost runs to $10,000 thus effectively making standard edition to cost at $15,999.

Now, coming to the "almost one-tenth of SQL Server standard edition" part. Since you have enough knowledge to claim that MySQL is one tenth of SQL Standard edition, I request you to please post a comparison statement between the features of SQL Server and MySQL so that we all can be enlightened about the 1000% efficiency increase by using SQL Server over MySQL :)

[Zeeshan Quireshi]

Now, coming to the "almost one-tenth of SQL Server standard edition" part. Since you have enough knowledge to claim that MySQL is one tenth of SQL Standard edition, I request you to please post a comparison statement between the features of SQL Server and MySQL so that we all can be enlightened about the 1000% efficiency increase by using SQL Server over MySQL :)

well i said that SQL Server has more features , i didn't say that it's performance is better , there's a diff between features n performance .

have a look at the charts on these pages , u'll see that SQL Server has a lotta more features than MySQL , also mate my point was that For enterprises who have a very large data warehouse SQL Server is the ebst choiceee , n for small-medium businesses , obviously MySQL is better , like for websites , etc .

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_relational_database_management_syste ms
http://www.tometasoftware.com/mysql_vs_sqlserver.asp
http://searchsqlserver.techtarget.com/tip/0,289483,sid87_gci1196735,00.html
http://searchsqlserver.techtarget.com/columnItem/0,294698,sid87_gci1190809_tax301329,00.html?bucket =NEWS


as you'll se from these articles MySQL may be fast but it's not meant for advanced heavyweight database transactions n handling. :)

[kumarmohit]

Linux has a great future in places like Kerala, where kids are being taught how to operate computers on open source operating system. When these kids grow up, they will have a choice. A choice that many kids in developed countries do not have.

Just Curious bro, (Please dont flame me as an M$ fanboy or Linux basher) but as you said that they are taught Linux and not Windows, how will they have a choice. I mean they only have a choice if they are taught both Linux and Windows and then allowed to decide what they want. When learning Linux they are stuck to Linux only or at the best the*nix universe. Now *nix is not the only dominant OS family in the world.

While am totally in favour of teaching Linux, I am against leaving out windows altogether. Just like wat is happening in Kerala.

Why not teach both the things to students, after all the part that is taught to students is not as difference as the kernel of the two. Let the student decide which he wants to study @ advanced level. Once given an idea every student can make his own choice. I mean its not the duty of govt to decide which OS should a student study. Its as personal a choice as to which girl/boy to marry.

[praka123]

@mohitkumar:
As far as I understand Kerala gov introduces Linux on all schools,windows is also taught in atleast some schools which is their right to teach.
But UNIXneeds to be taught from basic from school days to have a knowledge on command line,although now Linux GUI's are better and got more options.the distro which kerala sarkar made for students (http://www.edugrid.ac.in/webfolder/g/for_downloads.htm)are that easy (http://www.edugrid.ac.in/webfolder/download/schoolGnu/README.html).with Linux got many nice gui's like gnome,kde,xfce they got options-and if students wants he can learn windows too easy after learning Linux;afterall GUI's are whatever almost similar.I am proud of kerala gov for implementing this.now the only thing is some ppl wants to mix Free Software,Open Source,Linux all with Communism (http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/node/1707)-definitely not.

[kumarmohit]

^^Exactly, In some schools.

Its the same that is happening to Linux elsewhere. Why can we not teach both the OSs everywhere.

As for Windows being easy to learn after beginning with linux, I think that learning windows after linux is as hard as learning linux after windows. Your opinion may differ.

Totally agree on the communism point.